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haha, I might have to make an appearance for gunbound/smashbros/golden eye –a
its a shame mariokart 64 isnt in there anymore though
Hold on, hold on. Starcraft is back in the list? And people voted it in even though I wasn’t there lobbying for it?
Hmm…
I may have to begin brushing up on my apms again…
If you want me to host it or at least help out, just ask. I don’t really play any more, but I still know the correct way of running a good SC tourny.
…Also, I’m sad to see Mario Kart 64 get bumped off the list.
Kazul said:
Is the Smash events going by competitive banned maps, tier lists, 3 stock 1v1 best out of 3, 3 stock 2v2 best out of 3, and Wii Motes not allowed unless using the classic controller?If so count me in and also…
I have a Wii but only one GC Controller. My friend who I 2v2 with has a Wii as well if they are needed.
My history in SSBM/SSBB:
I am from the NC SSBM/SSBB team Taco Bell Ocho (woot woot top in NC). We compete at a lot of events and are quite competitive. I slacked off from playing both games due to fact the team has kinda separated minus Adams who is the 1st NC player to ever get sponsored (LoZr doesn’t count hes from SC but never played a tournament in SC ahaha). Only reason why I posted this is Adams might come stop by the college to Smash with me and just fair warning if I bring him by. I win 1 out of 20 matches against him. No lie. He is that good.
These smash events are mostly just a friendly get-together to just have something to do on Saturdays. There are usually a couple small tournaments, but really everyone just pretty much does whatever.
I’m sure if you wanted to play by tournament rules you could find some people to play with you, but the bo3 may not work; there are usually about 10-20 people waiting for a game so people just get bored and play it bo1, haha.
Also, there are a couple adept melee smashers hanging around campus who I am sure can put up a good fight, so bring all your friends and come play!
The controller is back in its rightful owner’s hands.
It took a phone call and about a 2 minute walk down the hall, lol
I’ve never played sciv before. I’ll give it a shot if it looks cool and someone cares to explain some buttons to me -.-
Hey guys. I had a pretty fun time at the first ever smash Saturday night fun fest. However, when I unpacked my wii just now, I noticed I accidentally swiped someones controller!
If you are missing one from that night, please call me at 910-389-9488 and I’ll give it back to you.
Alright, I’m looking forward to next Saturday! (Next time I will not be falcon punched out of the first round, though, so be prepared) See everyone there!
I can bring melee no prob. Also, I can bring my wii if we all just get in there and no one has anything, although my controllers leave much to be desired.
Just a quick question – when is it? You may have said earlier but I missed it.
edit: Oh, 6-o-clock. Got it.
Alright, here’s the scoop. This is my impression of every character after playing nearly nonstop with the crew.
Mario: An upgrade from Melee. His cape is even more effective now that moves are harder to combo and mindgames are more important. He has a nice little jab game and good movement that lets him rack up the damage pretty quickly.
Bowser: Since they made heavy characters viable, Bowser now stands a chance. While staying with a relatively same moveset, he now hits harder and stays alive longer. This being said, however, he will probably not be top tier; there are just so many better characters.
Donkey Kong: Right as Melee was coming to an end, DK saw an influx of skill as many people figured out how to play him competitively (most notably the player Bum). I havn’t used him much, but it seems that his new and improved metagame will be able to transfer over to Brawl, making DK viable as a main.
Fox: No more drillshining or waveshining or pretty much any shining combos. His shine got nerfed the heck down and is no longer a spike. His air game has improved with the usability of his fair, although most of the kill moves he had in Melee (upsmash, upair) no longer are instant kill moves. He is very much just a jump and kick character right now, but I think will shoot to the top of the tier list solely because of the masses of people carried over from Melee will play him and figure him out.
Ice Climbers: I mained IC in Melee, so I naturally tried these guys out in Brawl. In my opinion, they dish out the most damage out of all characters. They took away all of the old desynchs, though, which were what made the IC so deadly. However, desynchs are not gone. They simply are just different and require different timing. A staple to their moveset was the wavesmash. Now that wavedashing is gone, they no longer can do this and it really hurts. Also, most of you will be happy to know that their downsmash no longer is a kill move and it is really hard to kill people with IC’s now. Until people figure out how to desynch properly again, I don’t see IC’s receiving much love in the tournies.
Kirby: Kirby saw an overall upgrade in Brawl, much like Mario did. All his attacks are good (most notably changed was his dash attack. It has a bit of kickback on it now which means it no longer is instant suicide if you use it), his air game is solid, and his recovery is nice. The only thing Kirby is lacking is a decent kill move. Most characters can just outlast him.
Link: Link was bad in ssb. Link was bad in ssbm. Link is still bad in ssbb. Everything Link can do, Toon Link can do better. There really is no reason to use him, other than just personal desire. I do like his new boomerang, though.
Pikachu: Pikachu has been changed a bit. While his moves have stayed generally the same, it seems that the developers wanted to make him more electric-based. The stun time and priority his electric attacks have (fair, dsmash, fsmash, downb) is crazy. I would even go so far as to say his dmash is broken. The opposite side to this is that his tail attacks and legendary usmash now suck. The uair no longer spikes, the usmash no longer kills, and the nair no longer can be shffled into a grab. As of right now, I dont see Pikachu in the top teir, but he is still a good character. (and it must be the pichu from ssbm evolved, as he now can wear pilot goggles)
Peach: This princess has the ability to be crazy good. She is one of the few very technical characters now with her slidethrows and float cancels. While her infamous downsmash and fthrow have been nerfed, her fair received some love. I expect to see a lot of really good Peach players in the future just wrecking everyone.
Zelda: Zelda had a makeover. Her attacks kick SO much and her din’s fire is better than ever now. Since recovering isn’t an issue anymore due to the auto-sweet spot, she no longer is vulnerable after an upb. Nearly all of her moves are kill moves and do like 25-30 damage. She is slow, but that doesn’t matter. I expect for the first time we will see some people choosing zelda over sheik.
Sheik: Still incredibly fast, but her combos no longer work past 2 or 3. Also, her fair’s knockback has been toned down a lot. The needles still hurt, but no longer possess the game-breaking knockback they did in ssbm. I honestly think Zelda is a better character, although Sheik is probably easier to use.
Samus: Losing all the advanced techs really slowed down Samus. I never really was a fan of hers in ssbm and I still don’t like her now. She has a great recovery still, but then again, who doesn’t now? The metagame for Samus now is very campy and results in long, drawn out games, which I find very tiresome and boring.
Zsuit Samus: My distaste for Samus really turned me off from using her in any form. This being said, I havn’t had much experience using or playing against Zsuit. From the limited amount of times I have played her, though, she seemed alright. Her speed is good and her moves (specifically her usmash) have excellent priority due to the disjointedness of her whip. Sorry, but I can’t really say much of anything else. As a side note, if you want to start off as Zsuit, just hold down R or L during the stage selection and loading.
Yoshi: This dinosaur is one of the few who can combo still. He hits with medium force, and his recovery isn’t that bad. Overall, I’d say he has went the way of Mario and Kirby before him and seen a general, all-around boost. I predict that once people learn how to combo with him well, a good Yoshi player will be very scary.
Olimar: I decided to make Olimar one of my top 3 before I really knew anything about him. It did not take long to realize he is special. Already, he has shot to the top of the teir list and has generated much discussion about being banned (although this is very unlikely). Once he has his pikmin out, he is very hard to hit. It’s just like trying to box someone who is two feet taller than you – you simply just can’t get inside their reach. His smash and grabs are disjointed and have incredible range. The only times he is vulnerable are when he has no pikmin (but it takes like 1 second to pull them up) and when he is recovering. Due to the whip nature of his upb, he is easily gimped. As of right now, though, that is his only flaw.
Diddy Kong: One word – bananas. Diddy is a beast when his bananas are out. They let him defend and combo very effectively. He has a good air game to stall until said bananas are out. Stop the bananas, stop Diddy. He plays the role of a counter-character very well. This means he will defend and defend and defend, then all of a sudden attack quickly and rack up some damage, then go back to defending. His peanut gun is worthless, but is good for mindgames. His upb is a bit weak, though, which puts a damper on his recoverability. I expect to see a few nasty Diddy players in the future as he is almost a purely mind-game and spacing character.
Ike: Ike is slow and hard, which is not always a bad thing. His attacks do wicked damage and require good timing. His upb is ungaurdable and a gimp, which makes his recovery nearly perfect. And, unlike most character with a 3 step attack (tap a three times), Ikes’ is actually a kill move. His neutral b is good for surprising people and movement. Considering the popularity of the Fire Emblem characters in melee, he probably will have a lot of people playing him, too, which will help spur the development of his metagame. Overall, a very solid character and a viable main.
Lucas: An interesting fellow, to say the least. Unlike his counterpart Ness, Lucas’ a attacks are almost all mental and have very good knockback. His best move so far seems to be his uair, which can kill anyone at around 40-50% uncharged. His neutral b is good and is actually usable in game. The only thing Ness has that Lucas doesn’t is a dash attack and a really good bair; if you can do without these, Lucas is your guy.
King Dedede: Ah, here we go. Another character I decided to top 3 before Brawl came out. Turns out I made another good choice. Dedede is good. As a mobile heavy character, he can move very well and dish out powerful attacks. Since he floats, his WOP (wall of pain) is very deadly. Unlike Jigs from Melee, he has more to him than just a WOP, though. Pretty much all his attacks, apart from his fsmash come out reasonably quick and are viable with correct timing. Also due to his floats, his recovery is above average. He has good projectiles, can chaingrab a third of the other characters, and can defend easily from the ledge. Why wouldn’t you play this fat penguin? He has no real weaknesses, other than being relatively slow to the quicker chars.
Meta Knight: Meta Knight has a great air game. His ground game is okay, but nothing special. His recovery kind of sucks since its easy to suicide yourself. He has no real kill moves and is pretty light. It only looks like he is doing a lot of damage because he swings his sword really quick. I think most people overhyped him a lot. Right now, he is only medium tier to me, but other people in the competitive smash scene are calling him one of the best chars.
Pit: Pit is pretty good. He can camp with his arrows pretty effectively, then throw a nair or uair or forward b to rack up some damage when the opponent comes close. His forward B against the wall is the closest thing in the game so far that resembles fox’s waveshine infinite against a wall (responsible for the banning of many stages in tournaments). He has a couple kill moves at high percents (90-100%) that lets him finish the job. His air game is obviously solid, too, as he can fly. Also, I believe he has a decent WOP, if I remember correctly. I expect to see a lot of good Pit players.
Pokemon Trainer: I like this guy. What I don’t like is that you switch pokemon if you die. It makes you have to use someone you are not good with in order to stall enough to switch back. It would be like in SSBM if you switched back to Zelda every time you died as Sheik, and had to pull of two successful transformations to get back. A rather funny thing has seems to be happening in our games is that people mistake him as he stands in the background for a player and furiously try to attack him, haha.
Squirtle: I prefer the turtle over the dinosaurs. He is small (hard to hit), lightning quick, and has a great fair/bair. I think he is even quicker than Sonic. I have yet to use his b charge move effectively with consistence, yet I feel it has untapped potential. There really is no part of his game that is bad. Just run around like crazy and keep the pressure on and you will do fine.
Ivysaur: Some people like him the best of the three. For me, he falls in second place. He has a decent fair and neutral a. His uair is a kill move and his dair is a good spike. I cant give more info, though, as I usually just switch asap to Charizard.
Charizard: The trashiest of the three. He wouldn’t be bad if he could approach people, but he just cant. Also, I hate his recovery and usually accidentally suicide. His fair is ok if you are close, but whatever. As with Ivysaur, I just switch asap to get to the next pokemon, Squirtle.
Wario: Wario is just goofy. I’ve used him a little bit, but I’ve only really messed around, so I can’t give much insight, sorry. He can change directions mid-air quickly, allowing for a semi-WOP with his fair (and maybe bair?). His range kinda sucks. Other than that, his bike is fun to ride.
Ness: Ness is relatively unchanged from melee. His bair is harder to land, but so are all the shines nowadays. He was pretty easy to pick up in Brawl. His dash attack has been every so slightly nerfed, but nothing too bad. A solid char, but I think Lucas may be found to outclass him as the game develops.
Luigi: Most of Luigi’s appeal in SSBM was his sick wavedash. Now that that is out, he moves around the stage much slower. I think he received a bit of a downgrade from Melee, but then again no one around here really plays him often enough to allow me to make any concrete statements. I’ll probably see more Luigi players once I get online and will get a better feel for how he is then.
Ganondorf: The man hits like a tank. He probably does the most damage out of the heavies. As with Luigi, though, I can’t really tell how he really is, since I think he has only been played like 8 times on my copy of Brawl. I don’t think he is a bad character, though, simply because of the damage output.
Snake: A solid pick. You have to be very tricky with your weapons. Like Diddy Kong, he is almost purely a mindgame character. His most notable attacks are his dash attack, which is un-shieldgrabbable since you roll through; his remote mine, which can be dopped and exploded in the air; his massive combat boots, as any attack involving Snake’s feet really hurts; his usmash, which pretty much totally protects snake from the air (sorry Lucario), and the remote controlled fsmash, which can be canceled and dropped by L or R. It takes a lot of practice to get all the weapons working together well and even more practice to be able to mindgame them all with good results. I expect to see a LOT of bad Snake players and the occasional good one.
Sonic: The hedgehog is a letdown. He walks the same lonely road as Meta Knight and Pit as he has a good recovery and lots of little attacks, but really no kill moves. The closest thing to a hard attack is a charged up dsmash. The strategy right now with Sonic seems to be to just needle them to death with lots of tiny attacks. His speed and dash attack are excellent, but they are not enough to make him good enough to compete with some of the better characters.
Toon Link: I still sometimes call him Young Link, but whatever. This small child is a beast in the arena. He is everything Link players have been hoping for for years: simple and quick sword swipes, a recovery, a nice air game, and usable projectiles. The best thing about him is probably his ability to combo. His sword swipes are so that they allow for linking moves together. His small size makes him hard to hit, and his attacks pack a decent enough punch to kill things. I predict Toon Link to shoot to the top of the teir list asap.
R.O.B.: I’ve been playing this guy a lot lately. He can get some solid 2-3 hit combos out. Although most people think he seems slow and is unusable, his movement in the air is so awkward that it confuses and surprises foes. He has good projectiles (the gyro can kill!) and an unmatched, at least so far, airgame. His spot-dodge comes out very quickly and can be followed up by a immediate dsmash. Edgegaurding is easy with him, since he can WOP his fairs and has a decent spike. He will probably be high on the tier list once people figure out his movement and timing.
Falco: Falco plays completely different than he did in Melee. His reflector shield has been completely reimagined, which puts an end to his pillars. Also, his blaster can no longer be shorthopped, which was also major part of his game. This being said, no one really knows how to play him anymore. His projectile reflector will probably be really important, but who knows. People are going to have to throw all previous knowledge of him out the window. (I think his dair is no longer a spike, which would be a major deal, but I’m not sure.)
Wolf: There is only word word needed to describe Wolf right now. It is fmash. His fmash has crazy range and hits in two parts for good damage. His gun is strong, but not viable as a spammable attack. Just fmash and fmash. Then once you get done fmashing, do it again. Oh, and fmash.
Captain Falcon: While the timing and order of attacks are different from Melee, Falcon still can combo just fine. It is harder to hit with his knee, but is more deadly. His recovery is the same trashy hug, but this time you can spike people off the stage with it, making it good for gimping. I know many here will not like to hear this, but expect to see the Captain high on the tier list again.
Lucario: Hurraaaay. I didn’t plan on playing this guy when the game came out, but after discovering his beast priority, I couldn’t resist. On the ground he is kinda slow, but get this guy in the air and he is unstoppable. He can spam his dair like four times in a single jump, which is just crazy. His charge projectile is good; it’s easily chargable and flies straight and far. His throws can set up combos at lower percents. The nair is pretty sick. Pretty much all his air attacks are sick. The only thing he really lacks for attacks is a solid fmash. His recovery is not very good, but its doable. (as a side note, he is a good counterpick against Cfalcon)
Jigglypuff: Nothing that I can see has changed, other than the usual game physics.
Marth: Uh oh, watch out. Marth is sick nasty. He is probably better in Brawl than he was in Melee… and he was at the top of the list in Melee… so… Most notably changed are his b combo moves, of which the timing for it is non-existant, so you can just spam it as quick as you want, his b charge, which now impales and has good range, and his up-b being a killing move from any direction. Combine all of this with his fair combos, nair combos, and an easy dair spike and you have just a gross character. I usually have to resort to Olimar to take out good Marths, as he is the only character to outrange him.
Mr. Game & Watch: His moveset is exactly the same, although certain things have changed. His dtilt and nair are no longer killing moves, although they still have great priority and damage. His fsmash can KO at low percents. His bair now catches them for the whole combo. His fair is still short-hoppable and is a great way to approach. The weight has changed as well as the shield, which were his two main downfalls in Melee. He can combo well, too. Overall, I’d say he has seen a boost.
Alright, thats it. If you have any questions about characters and matchups, just ask and I’ll try to answer as best as possible! I believe this game will require you to pick multiple characters to main, due to the counterability factor of having so many to choose from. For now, I am playing R.O.B., Lucario, Squirtle, King Dedede, and Olimar.
Sounds like the PC section was a bit rough. The smash tournament, while long and without doubles, was well run.
Pictures of app from the car. We were in a cloud, so it was windy, wet, and cold:
When we finally made it to the Student Union building where the LAN was held, people were still kinda setting up:
Trevor and I left from the LAN building to go with some kids who were going back to their dorm room to play some smash before the tourney started. There was about 13~ of us:
We eventually returned to play in the Mario Kart 64 Tournament. These are pictures taken during the time in between my games (which I must say, I dominated pretty hard, until I lost in a very close race)
They finally got smash set up in another room with 4 projectors. This is Trevor looking intimidating before the grueling 5 hour tournament started:
This was taken during the finals match. The leftmost two people are playing, while the other 20~ or so people were watching. They were all cheering for who they wanted to win whenever they made a good combo or killed the other person. It was fun:
The long ride back. Here is us taking a break at a rest stop:
Overall, I had fun. The smash competition was excellent and all the matches were very close. They stuck Trevor and I in the same pool with like 4 other really good players. We both advanced (Trevor won the pool, while I snuck through in the last spot), but were paired up against each other first round in the brackets due to the seeding. The final count was 2-1 and Trevor knocked me into the losers bracket. Here, I had an epic game vs a slick Falco player, which had everyone in the room hooping and hollering. I eventually took it, only to be knocked out from the tournament the next round in another close game by probably the best Dr. Mario player in the state (The final count was 2-1 again, with the last match ending in 1 stock). I secured a respectable 8th place finish out of a very tough group of 32 players. I hung around and cheered Trevor on. He took 3rd place after simply running out of energy from a full day of smashing. The finals were intense as the person who knocked Trevor out, Charlie (wearing white in the picture above and using a defensive Captain Falcon), came through the losers bracket and won 2 quick sets in a row against the defending champion Angel (wearing black and is the Marth player who also won our LAN).
The prize for the top two spots were 50$ and 25$ respectively. Third place received nothing, so Trevor just barely missed cashing. Afterwards, I was so mentally tired (2 hours of sleep the night before + 8 hours of straight gaming) that I kept running into chairs/walls/ect. haha.
Just got back from the LAN
I played mariokart and got into the semi’s before I lost, then we played smash for like 5 hours straight. I ended up taking 8th place out of 32 and Trevor took 3rd. We got stuck in the group of death, though, with like 6 out of 8 people who were all very good.
I will upload some pictures/videos later tomorrow when I’m not still running off 2 hours of sleep for 40~ hours.
I’d be more than happy to show people how to do things in smash ^^ They really are not hard to learn at all, its more just remembering to do it in-game when things start moving very quick. Maybe I’ll start a thread in this section of the forums listing all the stuff and how to do them
TrebuShae said:
The N64, PS2, 360, and Wii are always willing to make visits to faraway lands.I need a MINI-LAN to get my MINI-training!
For your MINI-skills? haha!
I found this over at gamefaqs. While the information and discussion there is usually pretty terrible, I agree with every word this guy said :
Items: Tournament players choose not to use items mainly because of their random nature, also in melee items meant exploding boxes. Items can spawn at any time at any place, it isn’t that rare that an item interferes with an attack, it has happened to me at least a dozen times (yeah I’m kind of unlucky), the result is me being catapulted into the air because of some stupid crate or bobomb. Now think about this if you feel that items should still be used: By chance both players are far apart from each other just then a heart spawn next to the player with 150% the player picks it up and basically gets a free stock. Now the other player loses MONEY because of that situation. It is not possible to adapt to random, it doesn’t work that way, when money is on the line you don’t want something that is pure luck to affect it, when the option to take away the randomness is there (so don’t give me the poker garbage). Remember that most tournament players are of very equal skill and items can easily be game breaking.
Stages: Another controversial topic, I can’t understand why. Some levels force certain players to play a certain way, because another player has an advantage. Basically some stages give certain characters an advantage, that must be removed. Stages will always be banned before a character, why play a game where you can’t even use the person you want to use.
L cancel: the less controversial of the two well known advanced techniques. This has been in SSB and SSBM, this was very intentional, there was an update on the original SSB that showed exactly how to perform it and what it does, in the first game it remover pretty much all lag of an aerial attack, which lead to some insane combos. In SSBM it was kept in, most likely for the veterans of SSB who knew about L-Canceling already (Z-Canceling in SSB), however this time around it took out half of the lag caused by aerial attacks. This technique is in no way cheap and was intentional, it was most likely taken out of Brawl because the aerial attacks in Brawl do not have as much lag, and therefore was deemed unnecessary.
Wavedashing: The more controversial of the two well known advanced techniques ( I know there are many more, but these are the most talked about). This is not a glitch it is an EXPLOIT. Why? you may be asking yourself. I will explain. Every part of the wavedash was intentionally put in, heres the main parts: the jump and the air dodge was obviously intentional, the airdodge in any direction was intentional, the sliding animation of a character who dodges into the ground (notice the smoke around the character is different when compared to normal landing after a jump smoke). So every part of the technique can be used by any casual player and already is just not to the degree people took it. People have exploited this mechanism by constantly doing it over and over in order to achieve faster movement speed and use mind games. Was taken out of Brawl for a different form of airdodging, which i find interesting, being able to attack airdodge then attack is pretty cool.
I understand, Ephraim. We do need to discuss this if it is causing this much disruption in the community.
Falcon: Your games vs Dan were pretty epic, haha. Neither of you really knew what you were doing. It just worked out that you suicided more than he did
I’m arguing, though, that the basic techniques used are not that big of a deal. They just give a slight edge to whomever uses them. Like OhMalley pointed out for halo, there are acceptable things like this for all games that are easy to learn. I would try to list them for CS so you non-smashers could identify with it, but I dont know them, hence the reason I always go like 2-15 in our pub server
In all fighting games, cancelling (In ssbm’s case, tapping the L or R button after landing an aerial attack to cut lag time in half) , teching (Tapping L or R after getting hit to immediately right yourself on the ground and cut down time spent vulnerably just laying down), and spacing (Wavedashing plays a big part here. Basically, different attacks have different hit boxes which creates optimal distances to be at) are the biggest things you need to learn in order to be quick/efficient enough to keep up. The rest is just mindgames/prediction games.
It’s like rushing in Starcraft. If you are not capable enough to defend against it, you will probably lose. However, once you get better and faster with the controls/build orders, it no longer is an assured loss. Thats what separates good games from the bad ones. There is a mechanical aspect (wavedashing/cancelling) that needs to be learned along with the mental aspects (mindgames/prediction) in order to compete.
You call them glitches. I call them techniques. The smashbros community generally defines what is broken or not through massive trial and error in major tournaments with lots of cash on the line. Usually if a technique upsets the balance of “The better player will always win”, it is removed. Right now, there is a big discussion about a technique called ‘wobbling’. It is an infinite combo that is relatively easy to do with the ice climbers. A player called Wobbles was able to use this technique and defeat players better than him and went on to win the most recent Evo tournament. He received much criticism and hate for it from many of his peers, but wobbling was not banned by the tournament rules. Therefore, he was technically not doing anything illegal. So you see, even still to this day the rules and glitches are under constant review to maintain the integrity of the game.
How this applies to our situation: This same community decided long ago that basic advanced techniques, such as the ones I use in our LAN, are not gamebreaking. They just provide opportunities that otherwise would have been unavailable. They are not hard to learn, and with a bit of practice can be incorporated into your game.
Although wavedashing specifically is out of Brawl, it already has similar techniques in it, and I fully intend to use them as best as I can once I get a copy to practice on.
I can understand why people who are unfamiliar with the game would think of things like wavedashing, teching, and l-canceling are so broken that they need to be banned and will be glad to defend my opposite position to the rest of the console people at a meeting or something.
Honestly, I don’t think that even with all the stages, no glitches (who is to determine what is a glitch, though, and what was meant to be in the game by the developers? After all, the developers knew about wavedashing before the release and decided to keep it in anyway), and items, the results would be any different. There are only about four people in this school who can perform with any reliability during a heated match these ‘exploitations’ advantageously. These players would just adapt to the new rules and still be fine. For the rest of the people who are closer in skill, it would just add more levels of randomness into a situation where randomness is unwanted.
I think the reason why people were upset this lan simply is because of the small turnout. The very first smash tournament ever had around 30 people, and the rest were close to this number. However, this LAN’s event only had 18 people. The dedicated players showed up, as expected, which resulted in the casual players getting knocked out earlier than if there were twice as many people.
The problem could be solved by just opening up more freeplay tv’s for smash. That way, the casual environment is kept and the game is still being enjoyed. As it was, we only had 1 freeplay tv going at once which was being used almost exclusively to practice hardcore for the tournament.
zzzz
This argument about being ‘cheap’ has been done millions of times before by millions of other people, most noticeably by the famed Sirlin. I suggest you bop on over to http://www.sirlin.net/ptw/ and read his articles on playing to win, if you havn’t already. Maybe it will change your stance a little bit.
And on what MasterP said about not playing in the smash tournaments anymore-
I, too, obstain from tournaments (PC, though) because I know I will just get dominated. I’ve been trashed so many times at CS:S and DoD because I didn’t know absolutely every mechanical thing about the game, that it’s embarrassing. I’m not complaining (in fact, I have even more respect for people who can do that) but I just want you guys to realize it happens for every game played at a high level, not just ssbm.
Ephraim, I shouldnt have to do this, but I am going to anyway because I know a few people are still upset.
Before you start name calling and making accusations, at least hear both sides of the story. Unlike your friends who can only ‘claim’ things, I can provide hard evidence. Here is a picture I took of the brackets.
As you can see, only two names were switched. The person whom I think you are referring to that was excessively mad about this actually came up to me during the LAN very angry about how rigged the brackets were. He ended up all the way in the semi-finals (#8 Dekoa). Did he leave out that part when talking to you?
Also, you use the description of “cheap obsessives who only come to play one game, abuse every glitch, ect…” in a negative manner. Do you not do that in any game? In football, don’t they spike the ball to waste time off the clock? In basketball, don’t they intentionally foul during the last seconds in order to force a change of possession? In a serious CS match, wont you lose advantage if you don’t always have at least 1 AWPer on your team? Lets face it – to be competitive in a game, you HAVE to be cheap and abuse everything you can. If you don’t, you will fall behind to others who do. If the game is so broken that it is impossible to beat a certain strategy, then don’t play it; as it stands, though, Smashbros and every other game at our LAN is able to handle that kind of gameplay and still be competitively fair.
The thing is that with fighting games, it is much more noticeable when someone pushes the game to the limit (Leg-sweep in mortal kombat, anyone? Strong-low in street fighter? Wavedashing in smashbros?) because there is nothing else to focus on other than the players themselves. All eyes are on your character alone, so if you do 20 of the same attacks in a row it is easy to see and is incredibly frustrating to the other player.
You also say this, “Bottom Line: If you play for any reason other than fun, you deserve to be kicked in the head.”
My response is that, no, I am not playing “just for fun” at a LAN. I am playing to take the #1 spot and will do everything legally in my power to win. Now, catch me outside the LAN or in a friendly match after/before the tournament and you will get a different, more friendly philosophy. But, when the lights go off and the real matches begin, it’s all business.
A well ran tourney on a balanced game will have the best players finish the highest consistently, and I feel that the top three players did take 1st, 2nd, and 3rd at this LAN. A little known fact at this LAN is that Angel (the winner) was from App. I had never seen the guy before in my life, and therefor had no idea he was ballin before the brackets were made. It just turned out that he beasted through and made it to the finals.
And finally, even though wavedashing is indeed out of Brawl, there are still many many advanced techniques that have already been discovered. You can find the ever-growing list of them here http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=142139
