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I met him in a swamp down in Dagobah, where it bubbles all the time like giant carbonated soda. S-O-D-A soda.
I saw the little runt sitting there on a log. I asked for his name and in a raspy voice he said “Yoda.” Y-O-D-A Yoda. Yo-yo-yo-yo-Yoda.
Oh Malley said:
Topics of Discussion:Exploits/Glitches Issue
In the interest of keeping the peace, I’d just like to say the issue has pretty much resolved itself. Instead of of discussing it, I sugest we have a group hug.
“I bet you’re wearing space-pants, because your *edited* is out of this world.”
I hereby apologize to every female in the world for the preceading statement.
Back in High School, my friends and I used to play a game with hampsters and hair gel. We didn’t really have a name for it.
Okay, it was just me.
Nefastus said:
Epic XDYep. It’s half the Brawl soundtrack. My, is it ever lovely. I plan on getting the other half later in the week because my flash drive was too small.
Who has two thumbs and the best signature on the forums? This guy! *points at self*
That usually works better in real life.
While I think a full on Rock Band tournament would be difficult to set up, I am 100% in favor of a drum tournament. That was the best mode the game had to offer.
I remember a year ago reading an interview with Peter Moore. He actually said “The consumer’s choosing HD-DVD.”
I couldn’t care less about what the top tiers of competitive play find aceptable. Personally, I find these organizations to be silly and contrary to the very purpose of video games (fun). We are an individual organization which should base its rules upon common sense, not the rules of others. Cheap is cheap. Wavedashing does not give a slight advantage, but is so disruptive that it can win a match.
If something was not intended or spelled out in writing by the developers of a game, it is a glitch. Exploiting glitches is a technique which is garaunteed to earn you the hatred of all those around you. Just because you can do something in a game does not mean you should. Also, just because someone has an opinion which differs from yours, it does not mean they are unfamiliar with the subject. There is nothing personal about this debate, its just worth while to bang this stuff out in order to keep the peace.
I think most of the glitches have been fixed in Brawl so this won’t be much of a problem at the next LAN. If some new glitches pop up, then there might need to be some serious discussion about what is out of line. Personal belief: Genuine skills are totally fine; glitch exploitation of any kind is unethical.
When I play Smash Bros against friends, I have fun even if I lose. When I am beaten by a wavedasher in the tournament, I don’t have fun. There is no satisfaction in being beaten by someone constantly exploting glitchs. Wavedashing most certainly is a glitch. Go into Vs. mode and select a computer opponent with the difficulty set all the way up. You will see no wavedashing; only dodges. This was not the first LAN where many complaints were heard. There were plenty at the last few.
If we were to bar all glitch exploitation and the same people won, it would still be better as less people would be angry.
I think that the debate has become as productive as it possibly can. Anything from this point on will only lead to hurt felings. I am not trying to offend, just discuss a valid issue. A growing number of people are upset because of the methods allowed in the Smash Bros tournament. There is no reason to become angry about this; just consider it. Also, it is fruitless to argue about what people who use these methods should be called. To sum up my feelings on the topic: Wavedashing is not an ethical form of gameplay. If it were then why would the developers have removed it? Wavedashing is to Melee what spawn camping is to any first person shooter.
What if we were to split the Smash Tournament into two? We could have an “anything goes” tournament that is run the same as we are doing it now and a more open-ended tournament that bars glitch exploitation, but allows more stages to be used. I know that some people might be turned off by the idea of two Smash tournaments, but it is very popular at the LANs and we already have two Counter Strikes. This could keep everybody happy.
ZaplinG said:
As you can see, only two names were switched. The person whom I think you are referring to that was excessively mad about this actually came up to me during the LAN very angry about how rigged the brackets were. He ended up all the way in the semi-finals (#8 Dekoa). Did he leave out that part when talking to you?It couldn’t have been the same person. He quit in the first round.
ZaplinG said:
Also, you use the description of “cheap obsessives who only come to play one game, abuse every glitch, ect…” in a negative manner. Do you not do that in any game?Hell no. Have you ever heard of sportsmanlike behavior? The guy who beat me did so because he was better, not because he was cheap. I have no problem with that. What I do have problem with are folks who I see twice a semester showing up and talking about how Smash is their life and how they are better than 99% of players out there. Then they have their characters flip around the stage like a jackass so nobody can catch them. Wavedashing is a completely unethical form of gameplay and a large number of people I talked to at the LAN agree with me.
ZaplinG said:
And finally, even though wavedashing is indeed out of Brawl, there are still many many advanced techniques that have already been discovered. You can find the ever-growing list of them here http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=142139I don’t want to win that way.
The way I see it, we have a small group of people who show up at LANs for the single purpose of showing off with annoying, unsound methods and a second group who defend them. This defense only leads to bad feelings among club members. Quite a few dedicated club and LAN attendees are getting weary of rules which bar most stages and items, yet allow the most ridiculous methods for winning.
Also, how the hell are these people not Pros? They keep bragging about how much money they make at tournaments.
I like the idea of getting Nintendo as a sponsor. Have we thought about Turner Broadcasting? It may sound like that came of thin air, but they do own GameTap. Also, maybe Wal-Mart would be good; thats where I get a lot of my games.
I came to the LAN with an empty flas drive, and left with half a gig of music which was not technically supposed to be in this country yet.
Akuzan said:
There were not any “pros” at the smash tourney. Also all of the competitive section of smash bros uses glitches and if brawl has some they will be used there as well. Most of them take skill and for the most part those players would have done well without using them and from what I saw there were very few glitches used, Wave dashing being the main one which isn’t as bad as halo two was with bxr, double shot, bxb and so on. So calm down its just a game. Also overall alot of people come to lans to have fun but others come to have good competition. Don’t get mad at someone for wanting to be challenged.Wrong. These guys are pros and refer to themselves as such. Your post did not address the main concern–they were allowed to alter the brackets. I like the way my friend described the situation: “At this point, the only people who can beat the pros are other pros. Its like there is this elite group of people who play the game as a way to pat eachother on the back.”
The LAN was very successful. Mario Kart was a great change of pace and the free play was lots of fun. The drum controls in Rock Band were really cool. Still, I have a few thinks to bring up:
1. There is a problem with the Smash Bros Tournament and I am not the only one who has noticed this. The Pros have been given waaaaaaaaaaay too much control over the way it is set up. I talked to a few of my friends who claim the Pros were allowed to alter the preset brackets so that most newcomers were pit against Pros. It was a way to weed out the new players. One of my friends quit in protest. I’d venture a guess that the proffesional Smash Bros players have become the most hated people represented at the LANS. There is no shame in being beaten by a better oppenent, but when a group of ridiculously cheap obsessives who only come to play one game, abuse every glitch, and generally *edited* people off are allowed free reign over a major tournament, we have a problem.
Bottom Line: If you play for any reason other than fun, you deserve to be kicked in the head. I’m glad wavedashing and many other glitches have been fixed in Brawl.
2. Introducing Ephraim the Hippie! I noticed that we generate a lot of empty cans at our events. I say it would be a good idea to set up a few containers where used cans could be thrown out, then recycled. Maybe it would make us look responsible. What do you guys think?
