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This is the letter that I have written to SGA about their refusal to help us with our events. I will post it here in it’s entirety so that you can all see how our awesome student body president and his finance committee have *edited*ed over the largest student organization event on campus. That’s right, we are the LARGEST EVENT ON CAMPUS AND CAN’T GET $200 PER SEMESTER. Use this thread to let them know how much we appreciate their generosity.
To whom it may concern,
If you do not wish to sponsor my events, that’s fine by me. However, I do think that your people should have a valid reason to do so. They wanted me to get more than 10 members. The next day I had almost 50. They wanted an invoice. The next day they got a complete invoice. Now it’s too late. Well no *edited* it’s too late. If your people had listened when the request was made in the first place or if I was made aware that the budget code couldn’t be used as it previously was, I could have had all this stuff to you a month ago. These events actually cost the club around $600. There are two events per semester. So by simple math (since intelligence doesn’t run high over there apparently) that’s $1200 per semester, $2400 yearly. The last fund raiser that I attempted ended up costing me $90 out of my own pocket, and with a pregnant wife who doesn’t work, that’s money I don’t have. We ask for a measly $200 per semester. With all the costs that run through this organization, not including the events themselves, that’s not a whole lot of money. You guys have money coming out your ears, and I’m not stupid, I know what it’s like to have state money to throw around. The fact that you would hold it from one of the largest student organizations; one of the organizations with the highest level of active members on campus makes me sick. Our event brought 71 registered students before we stopped taking attendance. This means that there were probably over 100 people at this event considering it lasted 4 hours past when we stopped taking the attendance. You tell me an organization other than the marching band on this campus that has that large of a presence.
The Gaming Club does not plan to attend anymore SGA meetings or sanctioned workshops and or events. Why should we continue to be active with an organization that does not support us? You now have over 100 very *edited*ed off students. I hope the $200 was worth it. You want to freeze my account? That’s fine…looks to me like it’s pretty much frozen anyways if every request I submit is going to be denied.
Sincerely,
Shane Baker and the WCU Gaming Community
I have to say, as a non-member and non-wcu student, that this is outrageous. Some might think that this is poorly executed, but I think it voices the appropriate tone of disapproval. 200 dollars a semester for the most active group on campus is pennies to the administration. If the student life group/foundation doesnt do something about this then i can faithfully say wcu will lose a decent amount of prospective students just because of how cheap they are.
I don’t really know where to start or what to say on an issue like this, other than to ask what reasoning SGA would have for denying funding to WCU Gaming. The last I had heard, SGA needed x registered members and that was fulfilled.
Insofar as school communities go, this is one of the largest and best handled communities I’ve ever seen.
The events sponsored by the gaming club are massive, with enough diversity that anyone can attend and almost be guaranteed of having a good time.
I am not a student at WCU. I have thought long and hard about attending WCU simply because of the gaming club there though, and the only thing holding me back is the fact that I am so far along in my major I’d have to start over at this point.
It is my sincere hope that this issue can be rectified as quickly as possible.
-Rob Butler
ok kuros… talk to me on aim later tonight… i’ll be on anytime after 11 prob when i get back from work, i have a lot of info in this area that can help you, having been pres of a student run organization from another college
If they can fund the greeks, most of whom do next to nothing, they can fund us. At least we do something for the campus community. There are a number of student groups who do nothing but suck up free money, they do nothing to give back to the campus.
As a student, I think the SGA is reflecting the administration’s view moreso than the students. So far Western has shown little care for the opinion and voice of the student and simply taken what money it can and spend it on whatever they deem necessary. Logic and reason has nothing to do with such decision making. Honestly, if we must, we take the gaming club and make it its own seperate entity and rely on its community to step up and be willing to donate for the cause and the sake of LAN events. The community has before when a server was needed. Why not now? Besides, this is not just a student only organization. If anything, we turn down a lot of potential students because they hear from us on what the school itself has not provided and that we ourselves had to provide for at our own expenses. I still want to be a part of this gaming club when I graduate and I’m willing to invest what I can into it. I don’t think it would be too much to ask for the community to invest what it can since no one within the University’s infrastructure is willing to.
– Michael Moore
I am a student at Northeastern University located in Boston, MA. I’ve been playing on WCU’s gaming servers for over 1.5 years now and I can say that at some point in the next year or so I intend to travel to WCU to go to a LAN there. Thats right, I am going to drive/fly/bus to WCU just to attend a LAN. WCU’s Gaming Club has THE BEST community I’ve ever seen, and to not fund them is absurd. The gaming club is quite possibly the most active student group on campus just isn’t right. FUND THE GAMING CLUB. It is not a business, it shouldn’t have to raise all the money to sponsors its own events when WCU recognizes it as an official club of the university.
-Chris Panetta
As one of the members that was with the club since day one, and as as the former president of the WCU Gaming Club, I dont know what to say. Maybe it is the new SGA president, but i had plenty of support from SGA in the past. They donated a needed $500 towards the campus LAN events. What has changed? I have seen this club grow to nearly twice the size since i left as president a year ago; and the budget get cuts more than half? The online active community is reaching nearly 700 people. Our community is strong! We have students come all the way from Tulane University (New Orleans, LA). We attend your meetings, we meet your requirements. WHY ARE YOU GIVING US THE RUN AROUND?
As a side note:
Ever since we have moved our LAN into Hinds University Center, Not one of the members of the coordinating faculty nor anyone for the SGA has stopped by our events to see what its really all about. As the largest organized event on campus, This blows my mind. We register our dates 6 months ahead of time (which is probably far more than any other club/group on campus) Our event last a good 12hr’s. Hell we even get 3ed party sponcers to donate more money than SGA
Ending note:
We are a student run organization which needs SGA to support us, in order to grow into our mission. ” The mission and reason for the group was to attract prospective students to the campus, and retain students on campus. ” As it continues today, the gaming club is the first of its kind inside the university systems within the United States and is one of the fastest and most appealing non-profit clubs in the University system. This makes Western Carolina University one of the best schools to go to.
-David A. Griffith
Engineering Technology Major
Western Carolina University
I’m in my junior year here at WCU, I’m also the secretary of the gaming club and have been for about a year now. Before I became aware of this club I was planning on transferring to another school because I had yet to find any decent people on this campus (all the people I did know were drunk Greek socialites) The gaming club made me decide to stay because of the slew of amazing people who are its members both on campus and off. It really shocks me that SGA would be so ignorant as to deny such a successful and good natured group a measly portion of the SGA budget. I guess success scares the administration, the football team sure as hell doesn’t know what it is (yes I realize football is athletics and thus is completely different). I hope that they will reconsider their decision however unless they really do want us continually *edited*ed off. I for one will continue to support the club as much as a poor college student can.
-Chris Mouchet-
The SGA as far as I can tell has gone down hill in the past six months. We have jumped through all their hoops and they still leave our growing community with nothing.
The only explanation for their lack of interest in student run organizations that actually matter is laziness. The fact that we can raise way more money than we ask for is proof in and of itself that they don’t even try. Our SGA is by far the worst I have ever witnessed.
Their tactless lies and lazy attitudes are not acceptable. Their organization, as it stands, is worthless as far as I am concerned.
At least I am content in the fact that our organization is organized, doesn’t lie, makes good decisions based on sound reasoning and logic, and continues to successfully attract people to WCU. At least we put the students first. They should remove the S out of SGA because their organization clearly lacks any interest in the affairs of the students.
-Jesse Standard
Current CIS Major at WCU
I’m a sophmore philosophy major here on campus. My opinion of the school is that it is in the middle of nowhere, with almost nothing to do, no places to go an see. This place is the hearth and home of boredom for crying out loud. Before I joined the gaming club, I mostly kept to myself, read philosophy books all the time, and went to the occasional suck *edited* party. I went to my first LAN and was blow away, the feeling of community was beyond palpabable, you couldn’t go there and not want to go back again. I didn’t even know anyone there really yet I felt instantly welcome because it was so very apparent how much the guys in charge really truly cared about this.
Since then I’ve done as much as I can to expand the community and put on a good face for it, admining on servers and giving WCU a good word anytime a student actually asked about the school itself out of interest in attending. Before I joined the club I couldn’t imagine myself for one second recommending the school to others. Since I’ve joined the club I’ve made friends, hung around campus more instead of going home, and had a lot more fun. If anything the gaming club is the best chance at removing the stigma the university has as a suitcase college where everyone heads home for the weeked.
A while back in one of my math classes our professor, always one to get off subject, actually mentioned the gaming club. Some kid sarcastically piped up “Gaming club? What the hell are the going to do at meetings? play pong?” Him and a few other of the greek lifers whom SGA showers with so many funds had a pretty hearty laugh at that. I rolled my eyes and mentioned that we do a hell of a lot actually if you’ve ever been to a meeting. In my mind I’m thinking of the other times I have been to meetings for other clubs, with philosophy or what not. What did we end up doing? Chatting about philosophy, which while it’s my favorite thing bar none in life, it wasn’t so much club business that we dealt with. On that same level of comparison you could goto club meetings for the Gaming Club and you would see bar none the most active, dedicated and least apathetic students on campus. Not that we don’t do a lot in the philosophy club, it’s just that anything any other club does on campus is just simply blown away by the events, the organization, the man hours, the dedication, the trifles, everything we have gone through and argued over and pushed for.
Another illustration of the club’s rising profile then? Take the Carolina Core, they are a professional videogaming team that is currently competing with teams from all over the world, they just played London’s team tonight in the quater finals of the world championship, they beat them 28-15 live on TV. Big stuff right? Now here is the thing, their general manager Mark Dolven idles our IRC channel and reached out to us intially, not because we invited him but because he had heard about our community just through word of mouth alone. He sent us prizes for our latest lan for free, he is even coming up here in the spring with his team for an exhibition match to help raise the profile of our club and to get involved with the community. What does it say about SGA when a private entity knows more about us than our own official student government? It’s say you guys are being lazy, you aren’t doing your job, and you have been undeservedly elected and you can’t equivocate that any other way.
-Brian Brennan
wow thats rediculous. im not a wcu student but have been active with the gaming community for over a year now. i have been to a few lan events and even worked setting them up back when adam was around. i know the costs to run these things and to ask for $200 is nothin.
i cant believe what a lack of support they are showing for such as popular club… i mean does any other organization have people coming in from out of state to participate in the event? in the last year and a half i have been to at least 2 of the LANs, and i come from TN. Hell that one LAN ross flew up from freaking NO and met me and we came down.
and the answer to that would probably be a no…
i say we start a pickett kuros…. ill take a short 3 hour drive down and jump in on it lol
Go talk to Keith and tell him exactly what happened. Maybe he will have some advice on what to do, or atleast help us until this gets sorted out. In the past SGA has missed budget meetings and caused the funds for the organizations to be postponed until they sat down and actually met. Keith was always there to help us out in these times. I could go on about how painful SGA was when i worked with them, but I dont think any of them will actually read this thread.
Im pretty sure it is safe to say right now…SGA is a bunch of crock. i cant believe they would deny us of any money at all not to mention $200 bucks (Come on now)… hell i would bet $200 dollars that they havnt even been on our site let alone our lan events…So is there still no response on why the largest organization on campus is not funded by SGA or do they have their heads to far up their asses to realize or to care? Also where is all the funding going? im guessing an SGA member is part of another organization that recieves all this money for them…*edited*ing corrupt is all im saying…p.o.s spells SGA
Kuros said:
The last fund raiser that I attempted ended up costing me $90 out of my own pocket, and with a pregnant wife who doesn’t work, that’s money I don’t have.Oh, and SGA sucks.
This is absolutely ludicrous.
I’ve been a member of this community for a year and a half now and I will say that you guys run a very well orchestrated community. It continues to amaze me how many people regular on our servers and attend the LANs.
I’ve been to one LAN all the way from southern Georgia, and would have been at the last LAN had a financial situation not reared its ugly head. I will be attending the LAN in spring.
It’s safe to say that WCU is in my sights as far as where I want to attend college (I’m ready to get out of this town), and I can honestly say that it is almost 100% a product of the WCU Gaming Club. If the club itself is treated this poorly by the SGA and school officials, then God only knows how I will be treated if I choose to attend WCU.
I’m now having second thoughts because of this matter.
-Larry Garrett III
CIS Major @ Armstrong Atlantic State University
As another person closely associated with this matter, I would like to clarify a couple of issues regarding your club’s request. Mr. Baker–I understand your frustrations in this situation. Next time I invite you to deal directly with Steve Held, SGA Finance Director, Michael Frixen, Finance Committee Chair, or Bart Andrus, SGA Adviser, for it is these three individuals whom ultimately review and process your request; Casey is a wonderful aide but she is not the final authority when it comes to allocation of the SGA’s limited funds (Make sure you express your deep gratitude for her since she paid for the event herself out of her own pockets). If you work through the appropriate individuals, then all necessary information can be obtained. The reasons for the denied requests were because, through earlier e-mail communications to the Finance Committee, you provided details that a player’s entry fee provided funds for prizes with a little left over for website maintenance–there was never any indication that the WCU gaming club would be contributing anything to cover the expenses of the event other than prizes. If this is not accurate, the point could have been clarified through proper communication with the aforementioned individuals and on Catamount Connections. I understand you had intended on attending the Finance Committee meeting last night yet you failed to make an appearance. Only through later communication was it established that you had briefly come to the meeting, but the reason was for another inquiry as a part of your work with Casey and not with the Finance Committee. In the future, I recommend working with the proper authorities in regards to SGA supplemental funding. The other option is to seek SGA sponsorship of your next LAN event, in which case I direct you to Aaron Bloemsma, the current SGA president. In one final note, the fundraising effort you described in which you incurred the loss of $90 should have reimbursed you with that amount. And if you rejected reimbursement, then that was a donation on your behalf.
As for the other members of the WCU gaming club, your hasty and biased accusations also deserve a bit of fair-minded reconsideration. First of all, I am baffled by your disdain of Greek fraternity and sorority organizations. I can say for a fact that SGA does not hold them in any higher regard than other student organizations. Furthermore, they are competent and successful when it comes to raising funds and financing their own events–they rarely approach SGA for money because, well, they are responsible and capable of managing their own finances. Also, in response to MasterP’s charge that they do “next to nothing,” the Greek-affiliated students at WCU are some of the most committed and involved students at WCU, supporting philanthropies, charities, service projects, and other university activities such as Relay For Life, Up ‘Til Dawn, Valley Ballyhoo, Catamount athletics–the list goes on and on. On top of this, their members and alumni are among the greatest financial contributors, not only to their own organizations but to many other clubs and university services as well. I hope you don’t mind me asking, MasterP (and Mr. Panetta, the Northeastern student making utterly incorrect and unfounded claims against WCU’s SGA), but what have you as members of the Gaming Club done to promote your organization’s financial sustainability?
Oh Malley’s post is a step in the right direction, but it still does not hit the heart of the matter. The WCU gaming club should make greater provisions to provide for its own finances and expenditures. The complaints are numerous regarding how SGA has supported the WCU gaming club in the past, but the lesson to be learned from this is that the club should endeavor to become more financially and operationally responsible. Unless Mr. Baker decides to seek sponsorship of these LAN activities, and unless the club begins to demonstrate greater financial independence, then I would suspect less and less FINANCIAL support from SGA, and I emphasize “financial” for a reason–the SGA’s first and foremost purpose is to, in every circumstance, support student organizations and to ensure student rights. However, because of your past experiences in hosting LAN events and because of the impressive state of your current website, I envision your organization being able to fund and finance its own activities. Am I implying that SGA will never again provide supplemental funding to the WCU Gaming Club? Absolutely not, and I hope that this is not the impression your organization receives. Each future supplemental funding request will be considered in a fair and balanced fashion. The likelihood of their approval will be greater, though, if your organization is able to demonstrate how it is contributing to its own financial independence. Again, seek assistance from the above-mentioned individuals as to how to appropriately submit any future supplemental funding requests.
So, you may continue to express your discontent with SGA in these forums and continue raving about false stereotypes regarding other model campus organizations, but I doubt it will take you far. Whether your organization chooses to the work with the SGA or not, the SGA has nevertheless proven to be an invaluable resource to many clubs and organizations (Including yours, in case you’ve forgotten the thousands of dollars SGA has directed towards the Gaming Club in the past). In the end, despite all of the cynical and derisive accusations posted by your members, remember that the current state of the WCU Gaming Club is largely responsible because of past contributions from the SGA. I encourage continued cooperation between your organization and the WCU-SGA. I also encourage your organization to take progressive steps towards procuring additional funding, either from its own members, by seeking further funds from outside entities, or via other means. In doing so, your organization will be able to operate with much greater flexibility and with full backing support of the SGA.
In other regards, yes–your organization is a magnificent one, comprising one of the most active and flourishing student clubs at Western Carolina University, and I hope you understand that SGA backs your organization 100%. Nevertheless, the SGA cannot–will not–continue to extend monies to those organizations that demonstrate no contribution on their behalf to move towards greater financial security and independence. In conclusion, I charge the WCU gaming club to view this situation not in a negative light, but to view it instead as a call towards greater financial stability and independence as a organization. Take steps to fund-raise and host even more events. Perhaps one day you’ll even be able to grant travel packages to members such as rainefardreamer so that distant gamers can come play. Who knows–maybe even an E3-like event is in store for Western.
You may thoughtfully consider what I have said or simply erase the post from the message board. However, as a gamer myself and as someone integrally involved with the SGA, I encourage you to pursue the former of these two options. It will lead to a better lasting relationship with not only between the SGA and the WCU Gaming Club, but between the Gaming Club and the university as a whole. Please review what I have recommended–movement towards greater financial independence–with an open mind. The SGA will be there to support you but it encourages heightened internal efficiency in your organization as well. Before ending, I ask that Shane posts the apology letter that followed his initial condemnation of his experience.
Sincerely–
Interesting, I was hoping someone would post from the SGA or someone who seems to know a lot about the SGA and it’s inner workings. I am glad to see that my original assumptions were wrong and that SGA does seem to care about us here. I look forward to seeing what we can do together if that is the path we decide to take.
**I’m not entirely ‘in the know’ about everything, so I apologize in advance for any errors in my argument**
I’d like to know another student run organization that spends $1200 a semester to host events, typically has a turnout of over 100 people, and actually causes non-students to become interested in joining our university.
If the SGA has funded ‘thousands of dollars’ to our organization in the past then why is $200 suddenly a problem? Why is it that this semester we were told we aren’t a club because we hadn’t signed up on that crappy website?
We did everything the same as we always have when requesting funds and the SGA suddenly has us jumping through new hoops that didn’t exist in the past. This wouldn’t have been a problem if the SGA made an effort to inform our club of these changes.
We schedule and plan our events half a year in advance and for some reason an organization as large as ours wasn’t told about the new requirements until it was too late. Then you have the audacity to tell us that it is our fault you changed the requirements/procedures without telling us?
First we were late on filing for the first event. Then the second application for money that was filed the same time as the first was also turned down. We were told many things as to why this happened, including that we canceled the second events application. How about instead of the rumor mill, the SGA actually explain why we aren’t receiving any funding or open support (like openly attending at least 1 event in 4 years).
The current reason, stated above, is that we don’t have enough money and therefore don’t need any money. Does this also imply that if an organization has plenty of money they can get more?
If you are going to give reasons then please make sure that your reasons make sense. The gaming club doesn’t not like being treated like a red-headed step child. Most of us are very intelligent and we come from a lot of different backgrounds. Do not assume that because we aren’t politicians we don’t understand the game. I assure you, it is a game.
I cannot believe that you would say that, in order to be funded, an organization must fund itself. Essentially the SGA just told the gaming club that in order to receive money we must be at a point in which we don’t need money. What business is it of the SGA’s as to what our club’s financial status is, beyond knowing whether or not we have enough money to fund an event? And to that extent we have been told that if we don’t have enough money, they won’t help fund us.
We have been successful. The argument that we aren’t doing enough to be eligible for supplemental funding to cover a small portion of our overall costs is absurd. The way the above post has addressed our club is ridiculous. Talking about us as if we are in some way inferior simply because we need a little money. What organization asks for money that doesn’t need it besides a corrupt one? We are told that in order to receive money we have to have money.
We aren’t a business. We are a club designed to attract new students to western through gaming. Why is our organization being judged based on the size of its WALLET instead of its ACTIONS? Why does the SGA care more about what money we have instead of what we do?
The SGA does nothing but pretend to care. I don’t think it is the SGA’s business how we make money, only that we do raise enough money to support our endeavors. Part of that raising has included the SGA’s support. This semester we have been given no legitimate reason as to why we aren’t being funded beyond the fact that they don’t like the size of our WALLETS…
I personally would like someone from the SGA to post a legitimate reason that makes sense. We have nothing to apologize for because we still haven’t been given a logical explanation for the lapse in funding.
The idea that an organization cannot receive money until it has money is ridiculous.
Let’s please be big about this and keep away from flaming/trolling, only express your opinions if you are a student at this university or you know enough about how SGA runs things to bring up valid issues that need to be discussed and since we have Voice of Reason’s attention lets not push him/her away by being immature, lets ask him/her the questions that need to be asked and move on our merry way.
I thought that the official answered to the best of his abilities. If you’re going to provide a response to his post you may want to think about presenting it in a more friendly manner. I’m not telling you to but you should think about it. He obviously thought that he was answering the question and put a lot of time into responding.
He had to register a name and had a quite lengthy post. If you have additional questions just address them and next time he takes a peek I’m sure this so called voice will reign with answers
I’m now going to go finish coughing up blood
I must first applaud you for making an anonymous appearance on SGA’s behalf, I was skeptic that anyone even cared enoulf about our club to chime in or even taking time to read our inquires.. Thank you
Please review my responses (Which are in bold) to your statements
Next time I invite you to deal directly with Steve Held, SGA Finance Director, Michael Frixen, Finance Committee Chair, or Bart Andrus, SGA Adviser, for it is these three individuals whom ultimately review and process your request;
In my experiences it is entirely imposable to meet with all the “head financial directors” sitting down on one place,, what do we need to to to make this happen???
If you work through the appropriate individuals, then all necessary information can be obtained.
Why were we not informed with this to start with? What has changed? We have worked through Casey the past 8 events…
The Finance Committee, you provided details that a player’s entry fee provided funds for prizes with a little left over for website maintenance–there was never any indication that the WCU gaming club would be contributing anything to cover the expenses of the event other than prizes.
We don’t even buy our prizes, The winners of the tournaments receive gifts from 3ed party cooperations and local sponsors in Sylva. As a gamer, though you might know this…?
Who else is going to pay the $600 bill? If we wernt covering it bill,, and SGA deny us a petty fraction of the event??? logic just does not run deep here… did they pay for themselfs the past few times?
the fundraising effort you described in which you incurred the loss of $90 should have reimbursed you with that amount.
Its just one thing after another, we have been having an exceptionally hard time getting any form of finances from SGA.
I know stats funds are a hassle, However these past few epesoids (which i’ll let Shane Baker explane, as i dont know the details) it seems we are better off sending messages out into space than to receve funs from SGA. At the time of this thread we pretty much gave up at this point, we are just waiting our time with you.
“Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny,
Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny” all we get
Furthermore, they (the Greeks) are competent and successful when it comes to raising funds and financing their own events-
Rich daddy’s? Come on now, how much do they spend to host events? Are this events open to all WCU students, Dident think so. Not even comparable to our club. We support Western Carolina University and its students AT EVERY EVENT ,, not just ourself.
You said it yourself “their members and alumni are among the greatest financial contributors” Our club is not even 3 years old,, we have 2 alumni which both spend countless Hours to help keep this club running. Its cost alot to keep this club off the ground. We run $2400+ easily,, every year
(Greeks) they rarely approach SGA for money because, well, they are responsible and capable of managing their own finances.
And we are not? Its hard when one event SGA helps out with grand room fees and the power box fees,, and the next one “with out any notification” after the events are completed our funds are denied..
The WCU gaming club should make greater provisions to provide for its own finances and expenditures. The complaints are numerous regarding how SGA has supported the WCU gaming club in the past, but the lesson to be learned from this is that the club should endeavor to become more financially and operationally responsible.
-shouldn’t their be a better way to let us know before you “cut the cord” to our funding. other than after a event has happened and we are stuck in the hole to try and pay for it?
As a side note:
Why is it that it cost $100 to rent a room for a campus event? Why is it it cost $100 to barrow a power box for a student run group that only gives back to Western Carolina University and its Students.? We were hoping that SGA could cover these charges by simply dismissing them (where are these funds going?) The power guys is allready on the clock when he come hooks us up,, are we paying him extra. simple things like this is what we are bugged about.
Unless Mr. Baker decides to seek sponsorship of these LAN activities, and unless the club begins to demonstrate greater financial independence, then I would suspect less and less FINANCIAL support from SGA,
Not going over SGA’s head here, but *edited*.
We Average a good 8 sponsors per event in prizes alone. for a low number they donate a total of about $300 on average to support our event.
ResLife helps us pay for food and drinks,, as well as promotional material you may have seen around campus.
Our founders had to go through hell to get our gaming server a good $10,000+ box
And you are to say the WCU Gaming Club should demonstrate greater financial independence….
However, because of your past experiences in hosting LAN events and because of the impressive state of your current website, I envision your organization being able to fund and finance its own activities.
Fairly so, Don’t think your putting yourself in our shoe’s. untill this post was made we were given no reasons for the past (countless) denied request
In other regards, yes–your organization is a magnificent one, comprising one of the most active and flourishing student clubs at Western Carolina University,
Can you give us a list of the top few clubs and members,, I’d (as well as our members) would like to see where we rank.
Take steps to fund-raise and host even more events. Perhaps one day you’ll even be able to grant travel packages to members
Host more events? If you did not recall our events have always cost our club.
SGA has in the past granted travel packages to our executives to go and recrute from app state. again what has changed?
Ending Points:
As Gamers we welcome you to our events, just as much as we welcome anyone that attends Western Carolina University, our events are not closed of to anyone,, unlike other clubs and organizations. The only people we have denied to attend our events are gaming teams in the area that travle around and sweep the prizes leaving nothing in return. (See App’s Gaming only about 10% of their students attend their event,, counting the ones that run the thing.) The reason we dont allow this is because it does not support our mission which states: “The reason for the group was to attract prospective students to the campus, and retain students on campus“
We Provide a Unique experiences to this University, Which has attracted students to pick Western Carolina University over other schools (primarily Appalachian State University) What other club can say this? The money we bring to Western Does not seek our pockets. If you were not aware we are a non-profit organizations and all funds are resourced in by the club and voted on in our meetings on how we are to spend it.
We support the community and the local area and a hell of alot of students on campus. Yes we host these events because we enjoy them ourself, but you are underestimate how much time/effort/money goes into this club and to keep it running. We are not using funds from anyone who donated to our mission just to play games. We all wont this club to grow as it continues today, to become the largest most renowned gaming club with a university system. The WCU Gaming Club is the first of its kind inside the university systems within the United States and is one of the fastest and most appealing non-profit clubs in the University system.
As its looking now, maybe we need to side with LPM or some other student organization like intramural sports that see the light that our club brings to Western Carolina University, and its students. One would only suspect such a renowned club on the east coast would have has this extreme support already, yet we need to hassle with every little detail to get a ministerial fractional support.
Sincerely– David A. Griffith
Following,
I apologize for some of the remarks made by some of the members of our club that dont even attend WCU nor knows nothing about our campus or SGA. (public forms people like to flame when they don’t see/get what they wont.) And i especially apologize for the members of our club that attend Western and making claims that are clearly illogical and false, clearly they know next to nothing about what SGA has done for other clubs and orginazations on campus. try not to take their lashing personal, We don’t. It does not matter what the topic is on here, you always get “That Guy”
I appreciate everybody’s concerns. In response to the allegations made by Kappamerc, let me indulge you with an interesting little tidbit of information: The first time this $600 per event figure arose was with your president’s forum post. Had your organization presented these 400 other dollars and provided the funding sources for this other amount, the Finance Committee might have processed your request a bit differently. Also, as stated before, by communicating with the proper individuals, the representatives of your organization might have been able to provide this information.
At the beginning of this semester, the SGA Finance Committee hosted three training sessions at different dates and times on how to properly submit supplemental funding requests on that “crappy website,” Catamount Connections. These meetings were advertised through Catamount Connections and MyCat. If your organization was unable to attend, there were several people you could have approached who would have happily assisted you in submitting the requests complete with all of the relevant information. There were several e-mailed communications between Shane Baker and the Finance Committee for the first request. However, the review process for these was postponed because the University Center had never billed the Gaming Club. Thus, it was the joint decision of the Finance Committee and Mr. Baker to postpone the request, wait and see if the club would be charged for the second one, and proceed accordingly. Upon receiving the UC Invoice, Mr. Baker once again submitted the supplemental funding request for $200. However, no e-mailed communication transpired the second time because the Finance Committee was informed by Ms. Shawna Hipps that Shane would be appearing before the Finance Committee at Monday’s meeting. When Mr. Baker or another representative of the Gaming Club failed to appear before the committee and answer its questions, the Finance Committee proceeded in its decision-making based on information provided from the initial emails. In these, Shane detailed that the organization does not have a membership fee but instead charges a player fee for participation in its events which is used to “help pay for the prizes and various other activities of the club (mainly website-related).” There was no indication that the Gaming Club would be contributing to the cost of the Grand Room rental, which was the stated reason for the initial request. I apologize for any confusion, but prizes are an optional expenditure–not one vital to the success of the event and not one for which SGA funds may be used (as stated in the Finance bylaws). Again, to clarify and to settle any remaining confusion, the reason the request for the Grand Room rental was denied is because the Gaming Club was allocating its monies towards luxury purchases before attempting to cover its own costs. If this is incongruent with the truth, then Gaming Club representatives should have been present at the Finance meeting on Monday night, which was an emergency meeting called for the sole purpose of having Mr. Baker attend–as was informed he would be by Shawna Hipps–in order to clarify any remaining points of confusion.
In response to the question, “If the SGA has funded ‘thousands of dollars to our organization in the past then, why is $200 suddenly a problem?” I would like to begin by asking what isn’t the problem? I apologize that the Finance Committee suddenly asks for an organization to be a bit more financially independent. In my experience with the SGA, most organizations that have received SGA funding have been able to take those funds and use them to establish a base from which they are able to grow those funds and increase their income. But when an organization submits a request for $200 and the full details are “This is for the upcoming LAN event on Dec. 8th,” many questions arise: What exactly are the monies being used for? What other sources are they receiving funds from? What has the group already done to attempt to alleviate the costs? Every other organization that has received funding this semester has demonstrated significant fundraising campaigns; the first and only mention of a fundraiser by the Gaming Club has been that which resulted in a $90 loss by the president. Where have the thousands of dollars the SGA has granted you in the past gone to? From my perspective, you have an organization full of committed and deeply involved members that encourages a sense of community through gaming but, at the same time, it is an organization that, year after year, requests funds and, in the past, has unquestionably received these funds. Your club has grown content–something which should never happen. I implore the Gaming Club to unite in light of this situation and ensure the quality and finances of its operations. Again, I offer my sincerest condolences for you and your fellow members’ frustrations; however, I doubt they compare to the frustrations of the Finance Committee members when their unscheduled meeting was called on the first day of exams under the understanding a representative of the WCU Gaming Club would be present in order to answer their inquiries (which would have resolved this whole situation), and no one showed up.
You are not being treated like a “red-headed stepchild,” Kappamerc, and I certainly don’t think SGA members–who are also intelligent, come from different backgrounds, committed to their academics, concerned with student issues, and greatly involved–appreciate being treated as such either. No matter what, I would recommend you treat your SGA representatives as fellow students, many of which are devote massive quantities of their valuable time to participate in SGA, with the utmost courtesy and respect. Oftentimes the process is frustrating, and I wholeheartedly agree that the current executive administration consists of, for lack of a better term, a bunch of slackasses. But apart from the president and his executive staff, the Senate is doing good things: Were any members of your organization displeased with your academic advising experience? The Senate recently passed a resolution calling for reform and review of advising and advisors. The Senate is looking to install protected shelters for major CatTran stops. Also, considerations for the addition of an A+ to the grading scale are in the works. It upsets me that the occasional hiccup between the SGA and student organizations with good intentions sours the reputation of the SGA. Hopefully the Gaming Club and the SGA can proceed past this upsetting situation and work with continued positive relations in the future.
***Since I began writing this post, several others have provided accolades for my previous response. I cannot thank you enough for keeping an open mind and considering all sides of this issue before drawing conclusions. If you have any other questions, please ask. As for now, I have a huge exam tomorrow morning and I have procrastinated studying enough already. I will check in tomorrow afternoon and offer any additional insight that I can, or direct you to the proper individuals who can answer your questions. I wish everybody the best of luck on their own exams and a nice, relaxing Christmas break.
***Mr. Griffith, I have just now seen your response but I honestly cannot spend any more time on this tonight. Look back later tomorrow for further answers. I am trying to help you guys but I ask that you please be patient because I have a whole lot going on besides this matter. Thank you for your understanding.
First of all, my email apology was an email apology to Casey Carter, not to anyone else. Let’s see the turn out to our event if we had no prizes. I’m trying to kick off the console section of the club and we don’t have sponsors from outside in those areas. This club is growing faster than the money can keep up with. Every LAN event draws more people than the last and yes we asked for $200 to help cover our asses. SGA has paid for every event before this one. Nothing was ever brought to me about being more “financially independent” although fund raising was mentioned in several emails and I told them that the fund raising was insufficient in several emails. If I need to write a three page report on what I’ve been doing for the past 5 months, then I’ll gladly sit down and type one up. What do you need in it this time? You keep making excuses, and I’m sick and tired of it. You wanted members, you got them. You wanted an invoice, you got it too. Now you pull fund raising out of your *edited* because you got nothing else than I can bring to you on paper. You want us to be more financially independent? That’s fine. I won’t ask for another cent out of SGA. If this club has a problem with that, then they can feel free to vote in a new president next semester. I have more than doubled the size of this club since I took over. I have succesfully kept one of the top 50 Counter-Strike servers in the nation populated and high ranked. I’ve managed to bring another server into the top 1000 in the world. I’ll be damned if you’re going to tell me that I’m not doing my job. I’m not jumping through hoops. Keep your $200. I don’t want it. I’ll keep donating my own personal money to this club because I care.
Also, I know that there has been a lot of Greek flaming in here. I’m not claiming that you are blaming this on me, but I in no way pushed anyone’s beliefs in that direction. I will absolutely cover myself on that. It does, however, raise a lot of questions as to how the Greeks have managed to gain such a bad representation with the non Greek students.
For NoDice: I don’t buy PC prizes, just console ones. This LAN cost us out of our own pockets, about $200. The Gaming Club technically owes me over $100 on stuff that I put into it myself that I will never see again.
Apologies for the website comment.
I was unaware of any meeting on Monday. I’m sure someone knew about it but I didn’t.
We need more information on our requests and we will do that in the future. I can see how ‘funds for event’ without anything detailed and no one present to answer questions at any point in time could cause confusion.
As far as I know, prizes are paid for by the sponsors. If the gaming club does fund any part of the prizes I want to make it clear that they are a very necessary part of our LAN event. Essentially our LAN event is for anyone to attend and a majority come to play in tournaments. The winners of these tournaments are the recipients of the prizes. The prizes give the people that attend our events a goal to achieve and a reason to get better so that next time they might win the prize. It adds a level of depth to the tournament that does not exist otherwise, it puts something at stake. I would say that prizes and community are two of the biggest reasons people attend our events. These LANs are an opportunity for currents students to ‘get away’ from the academic life and indulge themselves in a care free day of community, gaming, and a chance to win something. For me to say that these aren’t necessary would be a lie because I have experienced about 12 different LANs around the east coast and none would have been nearly as successful without the inclusion of prizes.
I believe that prizes are donated by sponsors but I could be mistaken and will find out.
I do not know the exact numbers of our expenses but since they are needed I am certain our club will gather the required information.
I am pretty sure one of our fund raisers, hosted on this forum, brought in quite a bit of money for upgrading our gaming server. Next to our LAN events the gaming server is the most expensive part of our organization. If most of our fund went into maintaining/upgrading that server then it would be safe to say that we are not spending our money on unnecessary goodies first. Other expenses include but are not limited to advertising, location to host LAN, website, food, drinks, power, game packages(For use at LAN events only), and cabling.
The big difference between our club and many others is that we allow anyone to join and invite anyone who wants to come to our events. Our LAN events are supported by sponsors from around the nation, some of which are really big names in the gaming industry. Our gaming server hosts several online games that completely and totally advertise our university in a gaming environment. I have personally made accommodation’s for gamers who don’t attend WCU but are interested to stay at my house and visit campus.
One thing that was pointed out earlier is that we do not have many alumni and for longer lived organizations alumni are a huge contributor to the overall success of an organization. I would even say that a strong alumni base enables organizations to do that which is otherwise impossible for an attending student. I ask that the age of our organization and our lack of alumni be taken into consideration.
Since the Grand Room and the Power were both School properties someone believed that it would be the best use of school money to spend on. School money spent on school items seemed to fit into our cost equation well. I believe the idea behind it was to avoid confusion and essentially lower the cost incurred by anyone. Campus money paying for campus items that aren’t disposable = little or no cost to the university beyond the use of the space. I for one still support it.
To compensate for costs incurred by the LAN event we charge a fee, $3 for those who just want to hang out and $5 for those actually competing in tournaments.
To actually raise money we rely on sponsorships and internal funding / donations. Our unofficial club base is much larger than the student base and funds are reliable in that regard. To a much lesser extent we rely on the SGA to help us out with the costs of the campus utilities. Essentially if we need money, we look to the club, and if we don’t get enough we have backup solutions that we rarely have to put into action. If we need to we can start a gaming club t-shirt sale, a custom gaming computer sale, or charge more money per LAN / provide less food and drinks. We are a very capable organization that has come a long way in four years. We do not completely ‘rely’ on the SGA and we saw no reason to suspect the SGA wouldn’t help fund our events. Apparently there has been miscommunication from both parties and we do need to work harder, all of us, to get this ball rolling again.
I personally think someone from the SGA should come out and experience the next LAN event. It seems a lot of the confusion stems from ‘what exactly does one do with the money provided at a LAN Party?’ Those questions will be better answered through experience but we will also put together something tangible to help the SGA better understand our costs incurred and our funds raised.
In response to your first post, I would like to point out that E3 is a business expo, and nothing like what we do at our LAN events. A better goal would be the addition of an exhibition much like the one Penny-Arcade hosts. However, we will need many more years and much more alumni in the IT field for this to become a reality. Just thought I’d throw that out there.
Ultimately, no one wants to have any problems with financial means. The gaming club wants the support of the SGA and much of our frustration has stemmed from what seemed to be a lack of interest on the SGA’s part. However I will concede that the gaming club has not provided enough information for the financial committee to make a logical decision. Hopefully the future endeavors of both parties roll out successfully.
just for the record, i may not be a student there, but i have been through 3 years of college and have 2 degrees. i know what the hell SGA is and what it does. i know the comments were directed at more than just me, and some people might not understand what it is, but you cant just talk about people who dont go there like we are all idiots.
i have been an active member of this community for well over a year now, have been to lan event, set up, tore down, contributed… ive done all the *edited*
so as for me (and all the others in my position), i find that wrong to assume that about non-wcu members
I would like to give you a call Voice of Reason and talk to you about our history. I will not respond to someone who isn’t going to even put their name in the profile. If you are not on our side why would you even post In our forums? If you have a moment give me a call 910 489 6376 “Adam Faulkner” is my name.
In response to the “greeks are more financially blah blah blah”
Greeks also pay large sums of money to enter into the society. Dues, i believe they are called. And they also have lots of contributing alums to pool from.
I may not be a student at WCU, but I am a student none the less, and i’ve had the pleasure to deal with funding for events in the past as a resident hall president and as a student spirit vp. And i can safely say that i’ve never encountered any sort of trouble from the SGA. The minute you tell them that you are hosting something ON campus, for STUDENTS, to help increase SCHOOL SPIRIT, and COMMUNITY, they say wow thats really nice and exactly what we want every organization to be doing, heres some funding, OR heres a number, talk to this person and everything will be straight.
And also, this year our president of the student spirit group was selected not by the previous president or the previous cabinet, but by the athletic department. They chose a former male cheerleader who had no experience with gang green whatsoever, but was in a fraternity with a decent role. What happened? The entire cabinet from the previous year said ‘hey, if you arent going to give it to the most qualified person, then so be it’. And what did our new frat leader do? Give away the tailgating space to his frat, fail at letting students know when and what was going on, and basically, killed what was once great.
Why? Because he took something that was meant for the entire student body, and made it into something that only the social greeks would take part of, being that they were basically the only ones informed.
Greek… it reminds me of those people who go to church just so they can tell everyone that they go to church..
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Also, in response to MasterP’s charge that they do “next to nothing,” the Greek-affiliated students at WCU are some of the most committed and involved students at WCU, supporting philanthropies, charities, service projects, and other university activities such as Relay For Life, Up ‘Til Dawn, Valley Ballyhoo, Catamount athletics–the list goes on and on. On top of this, their members and alumni are among the greatest financial contributors, not only to their own organizations but to many other clubs and university services as well. I hope you don’t mind me asking, MasterP (and Mr. Panetta, the Northeastern student making utterly incorrect and unfounded claims against WCU’s SGA), but what have you as members of the Gaming Club done to promote your organization’s financial sustainability?That’s all well and good but the greek organizations are not financially responsible for the success or failure of any of the events you specifically mentioned. Most of the events mentioned are university sponsored events and are not even dependent upon the participation of the greeks. They’re going to have Relay For Life whether WCU is here or not. Up ‘Til Dawn is nothing more than a campus paid-for party, Valley Ballyhoo has nearly every group on campus participate, and even mentioning the athletics tells me you are grasping. If you’re implying the gaming club doesn’t have athletes I’d love to differ and if you’re implying the greeks give donations to the athletic general fund I’d love to see proof.
Also, since the greeks do so much for WCU, please list a few events that greeks planned and paid for entirely by themselves. If you’re going to compare the gaming club LAN events to university sponsored events the greeks participate in you’re comparing apples to oranges, lets stay with the same fruit.
The alumni comments have already been covered to I won’t re-address them but needless to say our alumni, the few there are, give just as much, if not more, of their time and effort to our organization.
If you’d like the gaming club to become completely financially independent then what’s the point of even being apart of SGA at all. All you’ve done in this forum is further strengthen our charges and accusations that the SGA isn’t willing to support the gaming club. We could charge membership fees but that’s not how gaming clubs work. We could have LANs without prizes but no one would go to them, that’s not how LAN events work. Please do some research before telling us that we need to deviate from how NORMAL gaming organizations work.
As for what I give to the organization, I am one of the most active members in the club. I showed up hours before the start of the previous few LAN events to help get everything running. When Shane Baker was in an exam last Saturday he put me in charge of making sure everything was set up when he got out, and it was to the extent possible. I won’t even go into detail about how the UC didn’t give us the number of tables and chairs we needed and how facilities management gave us a powerbox rated for 1/3 of what we asked for.
Don’t even start to question my contributions to the organization. If I charged for my electrical, networking, and management time it would easily have been $300-400 this year alone. If you want to see how active I am in games take a look at my forum signature and take note of all the online clans/organizations I’m a member of. As far as gaming goes, my time is a fairly valuable commodity and the WCU Gaming Club has earned first priority for it. Their community is amoung one of the finest on the internet and I’m proud to call myself a member, even if the SGA won’t support it.
Hell I’ll even tie my name to this…
-Mitchell Pate
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