Bitey said:
I am loling at this entire post, every thing you say is not a counter argument it is simply a dodge, as I was trying to say before there are arguments for it and against it, there are points in history where it has proven to work and where it hasn’t.
So citing examples of turning a failing economy around by doing the exact opposite of what you propose is not a counter-argument, it’s a dodge? When has lowering taxes ever not helped the economy? When has it ever increased unemployment?
Bitey said:
I am done with this, instead of trying to find a good alternative all you do is bash what I say and tell me I am wrong no wonder people get annoyed with you.
So the exact opposite of what you propose isn’t a good alternative? I said use the 1929 tax code, guess you ignored that. Since you want me to spell it out, I’ll do so. Lower personal federal income taxes to 25% max and lower corporate tax to 5%. I would say cut the tax on the poor to something really low but the poor already don’t pay taxes so there’s really no point.
Bitey said:
It’s quite an easy discussion about how we can get the nation out of debt, your way has worked in the past and so has mine, I propose an in between and I am wrong?
You can’t say “do this when this happens and do this when that happens”. Who determines when to have high taxes and when to have low taxes? Who’s job is it to lower the taxes back down? Who’s supposed to enforce the lowering of taxes? What we need is a system that’s PERMANENT, one that is always in place and doesn’t change based on how arbitrarily good or bad someone thinks the economy is. Since there’s always going to be poor people, there’s always going to be someone who thinks taxes on the rich aren’t high enough. Even if 99% of people aren’t poor and the economy is great, there’s still that 1% of poor that would make a racket about raising the taxes back up. Would that 1% be enough to raise taxes back to 90%? Your proposal creates a ton of questionmarks and leaves the entire tax code vulnerable to arbitrary interpretation.
Bitey said:
Also stop making assumptions about me I read your entire post but unlike you I don’t break apart every single *edited*ing thing you have to say and try to tear it apart. I hear what you are saying and some of it makes sense other parts is straight up garbage
It had nothing to do with you not tearing my post apart. I said that because your reply read like you hadn’t read it. For instance, how my “garbage” is supported by fact and history.
By the way, what did I post that’s “grabage” and where is your evidence?
Bitey said:
I like how you conveniently ignored the part about you defending the wealthy, anyone who defends the wealthy is a *edited*ing idiot.
What’s wrong with me defending people who earned their wealth themselves? Their success should be an inspiration that ANYONE can be successful in this country but instead of trying to create your own success you’re trying to destroy theirs. Why is that? What gives you the right to take the wealth and success from someone who’s worked all their life for it? When you work hard all your life and have enough to retire at 55 how would it make you feel if someone in their early 20s came knocking on your door and said that it wasn’t fair that you’re rich and they’re poor and demands that you pay their health insurance for life and finance their early retirement? It would *edited* off 99% of Americans, would it *edited* you off?
Bitey said:
I don’t care that they got that far honest to goodness working, you know what, they still did it in this country, and now that they can they send jobs to china, oh wait weren’t they supposed to be creating jobs?
Not every rich person sends jobs to China, in fact, the majority of business owners that do outsource are the ones that already avoid paying taxes, as I discussed earlier. I also discussed why they send jobs overseas and offered an alternative to keep them from doing so. You talked about Steve Jobs and how he dodges taxes, do you really think Apple computers are built in the US? No… they’re built in China by third party companies.
If corporate taxes were low enough to warrant doing so, they would build them in the US. That would create JOBS. Same goes for GM, Ford, Chrysler, HP, Dell, the list goes on. If they build it in the US they have to pay taxes on it at every step. They’re taxed when they buy the solder, taxed when they buy the chips, taxed when they buy the plastic, by the time the consumer buys a product it’s typically been taxed at least 5 times, for PCs as much as 10. If they build it in China and ship it over here all they pay is the cost of frieght. Why? Because other countries actually WANT manufacturing jobs and set their tax rates to encourage business. They encourage growth, as in, lowering the taxes as you employ more workers. In the US, as a company grows, the taxes get higher. Why would you expand a business in this country knowing that your profits would decrease because of higher taxes? It makes no sense at all.
Instead of having lawyers as representatives, why don’t we start electing businessmen and entrepreneurs to congress? Every time one is put up for election the media and special interests rips them apart and a ambulance chaser gets elected instead. If the government was run more like a business by people that actually knew how the economy and businesses worked we wouldn’t have most of the financial problems that we do.
Bitey said:
And if my family has to get by on barely nothing then why can’t we rely on the wealthy to help with that?
Because you don’t need to. My family was where you describe yours to be 40 years ago. You can’t acquire wealth or prosperity overnight, and if you did you’d squander it like every lottery winner does. It takes decades of work. You may never really enjoy the fruits of your labor but you can at least ensure that your children, or grandchildren, never have to live in want like you did. Hollow words now but I promise you in time they’ll become much more relevant.
Trust me, my family knows how your family feels. My grandfather came back from Germany without a diploma, married, and with nothing to his name but an old car. He cleaned aluminum vats at Alcoa for 30 years and not long ago got cancer from it. The difference? He invested every penny he earned and made the family live like paupers for it. He paid the $120,000 for cancer treatment in cash without a complaint or flinch.
If you get nothing else from this post, get this, you don’t have to crutch yourself on someone else to be successful in life. Not only will you be more successful earning it yourself, you’ll feel a hell of a lot better about it. For example, if a professor posted the answers to the test online before giving the test, would you look at them? Of course you wouldn’t. Would you feel better when got an A on the test without cheating? Of course you would. The victory is hollow without the effort.
Bitey said:
You’re arguments really are full of holes, stop making excuses for someone who has everything and realize the situation it puts others and how it makes them feel. If everyone did that, we’d live in a different place.
So wait. Because some are rich and others aren’t we should punish the rich to make the poor feel better? Do you have any pets? Well I don’t and it makes me feel bad so I’m going to send Animal Control to your house to take your pets away because it’ll make me feel better. How does that make you feel? EVERYONE has something that someone else wants; wealth, family, friends, love, XBOX, pets. What if you having a fiance makes me feel bad, is it then fair for me to do something to take that away from you? By your own logic, yes it is. What if Nickname being married makes me a sad panda, is it ok for me to try to take that from him? You say example is not relevant but is it really that different? Nickname worked on that relationship for 8 years, what’s the difference between earning love and marriage and earning wealth? Many would argue that a loving wife is wealth…
Bitey said:
Proof that you can’t talk to a person who isn’t in a position of nothing. You aren’t in it anymore who gives a *edited* if you were at one time, everyones situation is different. I honestly believe that if you sat there and told me that you didn’t want help when your family was hurting you would be lying to my face.
So because I earn a few dollars an hour more than you I’m wealthy and don’t understand anything about being poor? *edited* you *edited*.
And btw, no, we didn’t want help. You know why? Because we knew that we had to create our own success, that no one else would create it for us. No amount of temporary aid creates permanent success, just a permanent crutch.
Bitey said:
One CEOs bonus would keep me in good condition for almost 5 years. Where it would last that CEO about 30 minutes, this is the difference that people live every day, you clearly don’t understand or see that.
I understand. What I don’t understand is why that matters. 5 seconds of income from Steve Jobs would keep me good for a year but I’m not Steve Jobs and I’m not going to get his money. So why does it matter? What I don’t understand is the mentality that beacuse I have less than someone else that obligates me to take it from them. The grocery store has more food than I do so does that entitle me to go take food for free? If you think it does, try it, but don’t be surprised when reality kicks you in the *edited* for it.
I bet you’ve even cursed a power company before during a high-usage month, those *edited* corporations charging high rates for something that should be freer than it is. What you don’t realize is the government controls their rates. What you also didn’t know is almost every power company will NOT turn you off for nonpayment during the hottest and coldest months. It’s called corporate mandated compassion for the poor. Hard to grasp, I know, but it does exist.
The difference between me and you: If the government mailed everyone a $5,000,000 check the first question you’d ask is “where do I sign” and the first question I’d ask is “why is this mine”.