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I always wanted to get a feel on how the community feels on this subject. Some people think it’s ok to do and legit as it is part of the gaming mechanism. Others say that it is really *edited* and what not and abusive. Anyways for those of you who want to get technical on this let me give you a small gist on the effects of it:
Running w/ knife or pistol = 250 units/sec
Running w/ scout = 260 units/sec (yes it is faster than knife)
Running w/ awp =210 units/sec
Bunny hopping = 250+ (usually around 300 for the average hopper) depending on your timing and experience
Personally i think it’s perfectly a fine thing to do. It’s quite a elegant technique which takes practice and experience as well as map knowledge. Something sort of a more in depth style of playing counter strike. It enables players to increase their dodge as well as great for turning corners and other maneuvers. It doesn’t use any scripts/hacks at all (idiots and noobs use them for this…pathetic). It’s not imbalanced at all, meaning you can’t have a CT or T fly around at mach 10 killing everyone. (maybe except for scouts knives since that’s the map settings). It’s really easy to learn, and if you think it’s unfair since you can’t do it, or for other reasons: shouldn’t the people who practice things in life have an advantage over people who don’t do anything at all? And for those people who really think bhopping is abusive, why don’t look at the things you overlook, here’s two examples of many… 1) quick switching for awps (decreases reload time considerably) 2) throwing guns at the doors (yes i seen it before on WCU, which you can jam the door from opening).
So lets see what you guys have to say about bhopping!
2) throwing weapons in front of doors has been banned.
bhopping is an exploit in my book. plus it doesn’t work in real life. plus it takes really really accurate training to do it, not like your average weapon training on target practice maps or whatever. maybe on a skilled / clan / pro server, but not a fun pub. plus when you start opening a fun pub to this kind of thing, then the fun leaves… people start getting tactical and all.
1) quickswitching will soon be banned.
how can you ban for quickswitching weapons… that’s absurd.. i agree no bhopping… i can get goin and rush almost any map very unfairly. explain the quickswitching…
well, not a player ban for quickswitching… but the action. I’m considering a “in real life” / “programmer circumvention” rule… something the likes of if you can’t do it in real life then that’s bad, and one where the game was built some way for a reason, so it should stay like that… both bhopping and quickswitching would be in the scope of the “irl” one, coz any rifleman knows your gun doesn’t reload if you just touch another gun
and bhopping don’t quite work… and i def. never saw that at a track meet… and the programmer intentions… they made the awp reload longer coz it would maek more sense, and quickswitching is dodging that. quickswitching would fall into a similar category as mousewheel shooting, too… just food for thought…so falcon, mouse wheel shooting not allowed? (No because I do it, just so I know when to use the banhammer.)
Also, I believe bunnyhopping should be banned, as Falcon said, it cannot be done irl and I serious doubt the programmers intended it to happen.
Ellaine, you are correct in saying that a skilled person can bunny hop without scripts and such, but how can we tell if a person is good at it or is just scripting, which would obviously be illegal. In my opinion, admins have enough to worry about without trying to determine if someone’s bunny hop is legit or not.
Falcon said:
well, not a player ban for quickswitching… but the action. I’m considering a “in real life” / “programmer circumvention” rule… something the likes of if you can’t do it in real life then that’s bad, and one where the game was built some way for a reason, so it should stay like that… both bhopping and quickswitching would be in the scope of the “irl” one, coz any rifleman knows your gun doesn’t reload if you just touch another gun and bhopping don’t quite work… and i def. never saw that at a track meet… and the programmer intentions… they made the awp reload longer coz it would maek more sense, and quickswitching is dodging that. quickswitching would fall into a similar category as mousewheel shooting, too… just food for thought…That’s like baby sitting the weak, uncreative, and conventional.That’s almost saying that the people here on this server can’t handle it, so we’re going to limit a few things, so that those who can’t do it at the moment, those who are lazy to learn, don’t have to adapt, learn and increase in aiming, tactics and everything. I mean sure if you want the server to be fun for everyone and i agree, the server should be fun for everyone to enjoy. But have you ever consider it from the other side’s point of view?
@16 Determining if someone can bunny hop legit or not, isn’t that similar to catching someone who is walling? Or perhaps ghosting? Sure some dead noobs give away the fact that they’re hacking, others are more tricky, and you need to comprehend a few things to figure out, hey that doesn’t make sense, or why the hell would you do that? If you are going to compare what you can do IRL to CSS and use that to form a basis on what can and cannot be done, then there would be so many flaws. For bunnyhopping, are you so sure they didn’t intend it to happen? People are creative, bunnyhopping is just one way people adapt to a situation. Hey i need to find a way to dodge more, so i can survive and thus kill more, and do the objectives. It would be speculation if they programmers intentionally or did not intentionally programmed so that the bunny hops are possible. But i’ll tell you that they did INTEND in adding horizontal acceleration, which is the root of bunnyhopping, and other tricks.
correct about the mouse wheel. granted, i’m getting pretty good at seizure-tapping my mouse, but i still can’t empty two 9 round clips in 1 second.
elly, you’re welcome to challenge me, bring it up with Bitey, DeviantSyntax, VBloodLustV, Ephraim, Lootool, etc… or you can mention it to the next CL when they take their position. I may try to get a temp to start even as early as the last day as finals, because I’ll be long gone soon as this semester ends and may not be back for a year or more
Falcon said:
well, not a player ban for quickswitching… but the action. I’m considering a “in real life” / “programmer circumvention” rule… something the likes of if you can’t do it in real life then that’s bad, and one where the game was built some way for a reason, so it should stay like that… both bhopping and quickswitching would be in the scope of the “irl” one, coz any rifleman knows your gun doesn’t reload if you just touch another gun and bhopping don’t quite work… and i def. never saw that at a track meet… and the programmer intentions… they made the awp reload longer coz it would maek more sense, and quickswitching is dodging that. quickswitching would fall into a similar category as mousewheel shooting, too… just food for thought…Sorry but if your trying to make it realistic, your going to have to remake the whole source engine. Maybe make the glock a one headshot kill from 1 foot away, or being able to survive 5 bullets in your body, or catching a nade with your hand and possibly dying when you have 100hp. Like most players Quickswitching is infact a reflex. I cant scout/awp without doing it or sometimes even use a rifle, and when i dont do it its usally cause i *edited* up doing it or i miss the wheel. Also i agree bunny hopping is lame, but who says that valve infact did not bother to fix the bunny hopping technique and actually wanted it part of the game? Look at other FPS games bunny hoping in them is usually impossible. Like in TFC they had bunny hopping in that and it was totally legit, TF2 bunny hoping is still legit. Quake, bunny hopping is legit. If valve wanted to make it so you couldnt bunny hop, quickswitch it would just be as simple as taking 3 programmers. Putting them in a room, and telling them what to do. Im fine with bunny hopping being banned, but quickswitching is just going way to far, and its not like bunny hopping where only people who practice doing it can do it. Anyone can quickswitch regardless if their new to source or a amateur at it. Just my 5 cents on this discussion. Bunny hopping banned? I could care less since im not very good at it. Quickswitching being banned? Thats like prohibitting Sikhs to carry their Kirpans. Regardless if its a knife or not.
AngelEllaine said:
That’s like baby sitting the weak, uncreative, and conventional.That’s almost saying that the people here on this server can’t handle it, so we’re going to limit a few things, so that those who can’t do it at the moment, those who are lazy to learn, don’t have to adapt, learn and increase in aiming, tactics and everything. I mean sure if you want the server to be fun for everyone and i agree, the server should be fun for everyone to enjoy. But have you ever consider it from the other side’s point of view?@16 Determining if someone can bunny hop legit or not, isn’t that similar to catching someone who is walling? Or perhaps ghosting? Sure some dead noobs give away the fact that they’re hacking, others are more tricky, and you need to comprehend a few things to figure out, hey that doesn’t make sense, or why the hell would you do that? If you are going to compare what you can do IRL to CSS and use that to form a basis on what can and cannot be done, then there would be so many flaws. For bunnyhopping, are you so sure they didn’t intend it to happen? People are creative, bunnyhopping is just one way people adapt to a situation. Hey i need to find a way to dodge more, so i can survive and thus kill more, and do the objectives. It would be speculation if they programmers intentionally or did not intentionally programmed so that the bunny hops are possible. But i’ll tell you that they did INTEND in adding horizontal acceleration, which is the root of bunnyhopping, and other tricks.
Haha elly i like the fact we both brought up a few of the same facts =D.
Pink Monkey #16 said:
Ellaine, you are correct in saying that a skilled person can bunny hop without scripts and such, but how can we tell if a person is good at it or is just scripting, which would obviously be illegal. In my opinion, admins have enough to worry about without trying to determine if someone’s bunny hop is legit or not.that sumed it up perfectly. Bhopping should not be allowed for fun pub servers. thus why it is not allowed here.
Now for teh quick switching..
Falcon give me a gun and a knife. Its is entirely possable to pull out a knife from a shootout irl.
irl, it doesent take 6 hits with a .45 cal pistle to put you down. You going to ban that also? Note their are about 500 things in this game you cant do irl. You cant jump 3 stories off the aztac bridge and still run around like nothing happened. irl. you can not knife through body armor for an instent kil. irl. This game is not a half million doller simulator. it is in fact a $20 game.
Of course you can tell if someone is bunny hopping on scripts/hacks! (opportunity to get an admin who can see that
)Quote:
Ellaine, you are correct in saying that a skilled person can bunny hop without scripts and such, but how can we tell if a person is good at it or is just scripting, which would obviously be illegal. In my opinion, admins have enough to worry about without trying to determine if someone’s bunny hop is legit or not.It infact is very easy to tell whether they are scripting or legit. One, if they move SUPER UBER FAST even while hoping up hill it infact is a script. If their score is 0-7 and they bunny hop like a god they are infact scripting. If they have some crazy name like 34824hklfgdklfgjkd they are infact scripting. If they move four times faster than someone running with a scout, they are infact scripting. Its very easy to tell if someone is scripting just like if someone is walling. You just have to know what you are looking for. Just as if you were deciding wether that 50 bill is a counterfit or not.
NoDice said:
Falcon give me a gun and a knife. Its is entirely possable to pull out a knife from a shootout irl.lol not that quickswitching… when you’re carrying an awp or something you shoot, change weapons, and change weapons back all in quick succession and another bullet is chambered, ready to fire, eliminating the reload time.
Falcon said:
lol not that quickswitching… when you’re carrying an awp or something you shoot, change weapons, and change weapons back all in quick succession and another bullet is chambered, ready to fire, eliminating the reload time.It is if your Keanu Reeves.
Falcon said:
lol not that quickswitching… when you’re carrying an awp or something you shoot, change weapons, and change weapons back all in quick succession and another bullet is chambered, ready to fire, eliminating the reload time.ahh,, well how the hell do you eleminate that w/o eleminating the reguler qucikswitch button. it is the same button right?
Bunnyhopping has been illegal on our server for as long as I can remember and I am 100% in favor of it remaining illegal.
The quick-switching I can’t see being truly able to enforce, and I doubt I could even make a plugin enforce it because of how the clients communicate with the server.
no, not the button one in the options
switching weapons really quick is just fine. sometimes i’ll sit there and play with the mousewheel just to hear the knife sound and the whooshing of all the different sounds
if i do anything about quickswitching / reload dodging / whatever its called, then it’ll be just up to admins… you can see it if you see someone shoot an awp, their gun disappear then be pulled back out again… probably repeatedly.
Also id like to add. Most people like me, play in pubs to work on increasing my skill, timing, aim, and what to do when certain things happen. How can we do this if the most simple things (quickswitching) is banned? People have to work at what they do to get better. Just like if people cant quickswitch, hey practice, or if people cant bunny hop(im still working on it)
practice that too.“This game is not a half million doller simulator. it is in fact a $20 game.” -NoDice
Best line ever. So why make the game less fun by smothering with a ton of rules telling what players can’t do?
Ellaine, I’m not saying that its impossible to tell, but to be honest, I would personally not like to take the time and sit in spec for something like that. Then if I do ban someone for using a script and they come on the forums and say, “It wasn’t a script, I’m just really good at it.” How are we to tell? Then they get unbanned or they stay banned and all we have to look at is a demo that was taken while the admin could have been playing and just told them that bunny hopping is against the rules. Wall hacking is easy to catch, but to compare it to bunny hopping you would have to allow people to see everyone on their minimap and but not through the walls. Then admins would have to determine whether they could see through walls or just were using the minimap.
I am listening to the positives and negatives and I think have heard all the arguments, in my opinion bunny hopping should remain illegal. This is a pub, more than that, a community, new people to this community often leave very quickly when they see someone bunny hopping, I have also been told that is why they left. So I can’t feel comfortable making it legal knowing that it in fact pushes people away from our server. What I would like is a person completely new to the game to be able to come into the game and the only difference that they have under others is skill level, not their ability to bunny hop or any other thing a new player would not know about. All of that of course comes with experience, I don’t want a new player to have to learn to bunny hop just to be on the same level as a select few and from the looks of the votes it is indeed a select few that can and/or want to learn.
Bitey said:
I am listening to the positives and negatives and I think have heard all the arguments, in my opinion bunny hopping should remain illegal. This is a pub, more than that, a community, new people to this community often leave very quickly when they see someone bunny hopping, I have also been told that is why they left. So I can’t feel comfortable making it legal knowing that it in fact pushes people away from our server. What I would like is a person completely new to the game to be able to come into the game and the only difference that they have under others is skill level, not their ability to bunny hop or any other thing a new player would not know about. All of that of course comes with experience, I don’t want a new player to have to learn to bunny hop just to be on the same level as a select few and from the looks of the votes it is indeed a select few that can and/or want to learn.Okay ill admit your right here, but people can only get better in an enviroment with people who are better than THEY are. If they go into some server where their god after 1 weeks of playing because their playing agianst bots and dont even know it, they wont get better. Theyll just learn how to spray and pray. People leave for many reasons, not just bunny hoping. Thats hardly the most common factor anyways. I could careless if it stays banned or not but im just saying. You cant get better at something until you try it, practice it, and challenge other people using it, its just like if you ban quickswitching, youll have a WHOLE lot of regs leave because for most of us, its just a reflex, as much as just pulling that trigger(clicking the mouse is). Also the amount of people ud have to inform when they do it, before they do it, and if they do it, would just require way to much effort.
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