MasterP said:
NuRayZ said:
again it’s not all about money masterp, what did we have to show for those 8 glorious years of tax cuts, war, and spending?
The highest Dow Jones in the history of the stock market. I’d say that’s at least worth something…
Bitey said:
I’m just gonna stop commenting completely until MasterP realizes that I am not an Obama supporterWhere did I say you were an Obama supporter? Please, link it and I’ll apologize. What I said was none of what you wanted would happen under Obama, which pretty much implies you to be the exact opposite of an Obama supporter.
From the tone and content of the rest of your reply it looks like you didn’t actually read my reply earlier. It looks like you saw some Great Depression history that didn’t jive with what you thought you knew so you skimmed down until you saw Obama mentioned then raged.
Bitey said:
It’s pointless for me to argue if all you are going to do is bash me because you think I support Obama, I am neither a socialist nor a conservative.
If you like high taxes, “big brother” government, and “make everyone equal” government programs then by definition you are either socialist, marxist, or communist. Your posts and ideals are textbook socialism. Go read what socialism means because you are it, you fit the definition almost exactly.
Since you didn’t read my reply in the other post I’ll quote it here:
MasterP said:
While there’s nothing wrong with socialism in theory, in practice it fails miserably every time. Sorry, I mean it just, does.
There’s always going to be an upper class and a lower class. The most successful countries in history are those with a middle class, something that socialist countries generally destroy very quickly. We can switch to socialism, and everyone will be happy for a while, but after the love affair is over you’ll find that those that were the upper class still are and everyone who didn’t measure up is now essentially slave labor. I guess everyone being poor is fairer than the 13-17% we average now, unless you’re in the 83-87% who isn’t.
Sorry to be so mathematical about this but that’s how you’ve got to look at it. There’s always going to be poor people, and there’s always going to be rich people. Your goal in life should be to get as high as you can without stepping on others. If you give all your money away while being poor, you’ll always be poor, and the overall good you do for society will be minimal however if you focus entirely on yourself until you’ve planted your feet in solid financial ground you’ll be in a much better position to actually do some good for the less fortunate. Yes I’m a greedy *edited*, yes I hoard my money, but that means that when I want to give to a good cause I actually have the money to make a difference. Everyone can give $5 to a cause but its the people that give $500 that keep those causes alive.
Bitey said:
What I can’t stand for right now is the inability for conservatives to see that the obnoxiously wealth are killing our economy. Do you not realize that defending them makes you look like a complete jack *edited*? Let’s defend the guy who sits on a throne instead of the guy who makes an honest day to day living, YEAH THAT MAKES PERFECT SENSE, GOD I BET THE GUY ON THE THRONE IS PERFECT AND HAS DONE NOTHING WRONG HE DESERVES ALL OF THAT MONEY!What you fail to realize is that the vast majority of the wealthy got it by honest, day to day living. The difference being they targetting their labor into more productive enterprises or simply rose the corporate ladder better. What you’re saying is that since they’re more successful than you are, as a nation, we should punish them with 90% taxes. How is that fair? Who determines what is and is not “wealthy”? What happens when people start thinking that anything above minimum wage should be taxed 90%? Surely you don’t think THAT’S fair…
Bitey said:
I didn’t say Mellon’s sole reason for doing the tax cuts was to lower what he paid, I am sure he had many other alternate reasons, I was just pointing out how much he saved in doing so, I am sure that was a pretty big reason for him doing it too though. “Oh hey look I can save about $800,000 dollars just by giving all the wealthy a tax cut, we deserve it we have been spending money in this country for a while.” And so they have, again I cannot deny some of his other reasons, they do make sense.
So again I ask, are you saying Mellon’s primary reason for creating the biggest short-term economic boom in this country’s history was for personal tax savings? Will you not admit that what he did was smart for the economy as a whole and not just for his own wallet?
Bitey said:
So here is the honest to God truth, when the economy is down, we need to tax the *edited* out of the rich. When it is up and we are in peace times, national debt is down, give them a tax cut. I think that is a fair solution for everyone.So you haven’t read anything I’ve posted here. Go re-read my first post which details how and why that policy doesn’t work and gives a historic example of when the exact opposite worked beautifully. I’m not going to waste my time retyping it, it’s not what you want to hear and puts a giant crack in your view of reality so I’m not really expecting you to read it. At least pretend like you did though so you aren’t saying the same things over and over after being proven wrong by your own historic example.
Bitey said:
Also please provide links MasterP cause I honestly think you made up about 70% of your entire post.Everything I posted is supported by textbooks, wikipedia, and google. Sorry it hurts but socialists and liberals rarely know their history which is why your policies continually destroy our economy and those “greedy rich” conservative policies always spark growth cycles in it.
NuRayZ said:
thats the thing bitey if you aren’t with them you are against them. That’s the conservative mentality. their way or the *edited*ing highway. the know it all party man.
Last I checked you can’t raise tax on the “wealthy” to 90% AND lower them to 25% at the same time. I know the liberal perspective is hard to support with facts and examples in threads like this but at least try posting something constructive. Instead of random pop-shots at opinions, supported by facts, that you don’t like.
I give kudos to Bitey for posting coherent sentences that aren’t entirely made out of talking points. He at least expresses his own opinion and as wrong as I may think, it’s his and his alone. Not identical in every way to that of half the people on TV and in Washington.
I am loling at this entire post, every thing you say is not a counter argument it is simply a dodge, as I was trying to say before there are arguments for it and against it, there are points in history where it has proven to work and where it hasn’t. You can’t quote history to me and then not observe other points of it. I am done with this, instead of trying to find a good alternative all you do is bash what I say and tell me I am wrong no wonder people get annoyed with you. It’s quite an easy discussion about how we can get the nation out of debt, your way has worked in the past and so has mine, I propose an in between and I am wrong? Right… OK sure. Also stop making assumptions about me I read your entire post but unlike you I don’t break apart every single *edited*ing thing you have to say and try to tear it apart. I hear what you are saying and some of it makes sense other parts is straight up garbage, I like how you conveniently ignored the part about you defending the wealthy, anyone who defends the wealthy is a *edited*ing idiot. I don’t care that they got that far honest to goodness working, you know what, they still did it in this country, and now that they can they send jobs to china, oh wait weren’t they supposed to be creating jobs? And if my family has to get by on barely nothing then why can’t we rely on the wealthy to help with that? You’re arguments really are full of holes, stop making excuses for someone who has everything and realize the situation it puts others and how it makes them feel. If everyone did that, we’d live in a different place.
Proof that you can’t talk to a person who isn’t in a position of nothing. You aren’t in it anymore who gives a *edited* if you were at one time, everyones situation is different. I honestly believe that if you sat there and told me that you didn’t want help when your family was hurting you would be lying to my face. I bet even Bill Gates if he was ever poor would wish and hope for support from a rich family, anyone who wasn’t would be lying in my opinion. Do you know how much a measly $20k would do for my family? That is like .20 cents to a person like Bill Gates, $20 bucks to someone like Oprah.
I get it, they “earned” this money, so obviously that entitles them to everything else too, you know what I earn every *edited*ing cent I make, so that entitles me to some bonuses too. One CEOs bonus would keep me in good condition for almost 5 years. Where it would last that CEO about 30 minutes, this is the difference that people live every day, you clearly don’t understand or see that.